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Old 12 May 2012, 14:54   #1
White of High
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Default 117. California Dreamin'

This is the START OUT OF HELL & ARRIVE TO HEAVEN topic.
Let's Go to Rock 'n' Roll!!!!!!!

California Dreamin' (5)

I'm not a fan of covered songs, except Knockin' On Heaven's Door by Guns and Stand By Me by Meat. This song is far from the original one what is not my cup of tea either. The saxophone is great, Patti's voice is perfect, Meat's voice doesn't fit on it.

My score: 5
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Old 12 May 2012, 15:09   #2
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Old 12 May 2012, 15:13   #3
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6. Love the arrangement (and I think it's light years beyond the original), but Meat's voice is too powerful for the song and whatever was done to Patti's voice doesn't agree with me. Brilliant saxophone work, though. Meat needs to use more sax in general :P

Last edited by Mr. Happy; 12 May 2012 at 15:26.
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Old 12 May 2012, 15:21   #4
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Simply and clearly - good job Meat



- I like covers done by Meat like: "It's All Coming Back To Me Now", "Bad For Good", "Left In The Dark", "Out Of The Frying Pan", "Lost Boys And Golden Girls", "Surf's Up" or non-Steinman like "Black Betty".

- Saxophone is a brilliant idea.

- Patti Russo did an amazing job.

- "Hell In A Handbasket" is on the 3rd position in my private ranking of Meat's albums.

- Meat's voice is perfect now ... at least to me (and perhaps to many other fans).



Score: 9,5/10
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Old 12 May 2012, 15:25   #5
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This song is brilliant to me.

I was not a fan of the original, so I was curious to see what Meat and company would bring to the table, and I think they hit it out of the park on this one.

They were able to take something old and make it new again, and IMHO they made it better.

Love the vocals from both Meat and Patti, and also love the fact that Dave Luther really gets to shine on this track.

10/10 from me.
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Old 12 May 2012, 15:59   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkeaholic View Post
This song is brilliant to me.

I was not a fan of the original, so I was curious to see what Meat and company would bring to the table, and I think they hit it out of the park on this one.

They were able to take something old and make it new again, and IMHO they made it better.

Love the vocals from both Meat and Patti, and also love the fact that Dave Luther really gets to shine on this track.

10/10 from me.
Brilliant to me also I quite liked the original, loved Mama Cass's voice, but it always had a sadness about it which I couldn't quite put my finger on. Meat brought out the deeper meaning to it imo, and gave it a new strength. Vocals are perfect, love the mournfully wistful sax, and it's a solid 10 from me

Caryl
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Old 12 May 2012, 16:39   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by White of High View Post
Meat's voice doesn't fit on it.
Voice does, style of singing doesn't. Unfortunately it conceals features of the voice that would have suited the song perfectly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meat Loaf_fan View Post
- Saxophone is a brilliant idea.
The Beach Boys did that before but their approach to the song was different. On Meat Loaf's version it is an integral part of the atmosphere. I like the fact that his take on California Dreamin' appears slower and darker, almost spooky. All in all a very good cover, although Meat Loaf's vocals on it are not my cup of tea for the most part.
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Old 12 May 2012, 16:47   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkeaholic View Post
This song is brilliant to me.

I was not a fan of the original, so I was curious to see what Meat and company would bring to the table, and I think they hit it out of the park on this one.

They were able to take something old and make it new again, and IMHO they made it better.

Love the vocals from both Meat and Patti, and also love the fact that Dave Luther really gets to shine on this track.

10/10 from me.
It's one of my favorite tracks on the CD.
10/10 from me
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Old 12 May 2012, 17:44   #9
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[QUOTE=Meat Loaf_fan;569958]
Meat's voice is perfect now ... at least to me (and perhaps to many other fans).

yes, i love meat's voice and ever loved it
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Old 12 May 2012, 17:47   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkeaholic View Post
This song is brilliant to me.

I was not a fan of the original, so I was curious to see what Meat and company would bring to the table, and I think they hit it out of the park on this one.

They were able to take something old and make it new again, and IMHO they made it better.

Love the vocals from both Meat and Patti, and also love the fact that Dave Luther really gets to shine on this track.

10/10 from me.
i absolutely agree, imo meat's version is much better than the original ... take a look at the lyrics ...
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Old 12 May 2012, 19:05   #11
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take a look at the lyrics ...
As far as I recall they only differ from each other with regard to one word. Meat Loaf sings "began to pray" instead of "pretend to pray". The original line is more interesting, in my opinion.
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Old 12 May 2012, 20:36   #12
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Old 13 May 2012, 00:19   #13
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White of high : Is there 1 song that you DO like on that album ?????? California dreamin', Meat and Patti's version is awesome, they bring out the true meaning of that song.

So again... it deserves a 10 to me !!
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Old 13 May 2012, 00:36   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJLeen
White of high : Is there 1 song that you DO like on that album ?????? California dreamin', Meat and Patti's version is awesome, they bring out the true meaning of that song.

So again... it deserves a 10 to me !!
White of High tends to seemingly not like anything that isn't the Meat/Jim combo.

Some people just can't handle the new direction
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Old 13 May 2012, 03:03   #15
Julie in the rv mirror
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I'll admit I wasn't very fond of it on first listen, but it grew on me over time. It's a solid "like" for me.
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Old 13 May 2012, 04:25   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkeaholic View Post
This song is brilliant to me.

I was not a fan of the original, so I was curious to see what Meat and company would bring to the table, and I think they hit it out of the park on this one.

They were able to take something old and make it new again, and IMHO they made it better.

Love the vocals from both Meat and Patti, and also love the fact that Dave Luther really gets to shine on this track.

10/10 from me.
Totally agree - I think the new arrangement is BRILLIANT!

10/10
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Old 13 May 2012, 06:15   #17
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Love tihs cover!!! IMO this song is Meat's best cover of a well known song and it's the best song on the album and his best vocal on the album. The production is AMAZING on this song.

10/10
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Old 13 May 2012, 12:06   #18
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7.5

I think what Meat's done with the track is awesome. It's a song about depression, and it really comes through with this version, especially given the broken, haunted tone they've gone for. The only thing that bothers me - I wish Meat would've used a more restrained vocal, particularly at the beginning. But hey, that's just me.
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Old 13 May 2012, 15:42   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkeaholic View Post
White of High tends to seemingly not like anything that isn't the Meat/Jim combo.
To be fair he has rated some non-Steinman songs as high as 8 and above .. even HCTB's Song of Madness rated in the nines I think. But songs seem to need a Steinman/Bat style to get real approval, and you're right imo that Meat's new style seems to have limited appeal. He has also despaired of those of us who rate anything 10

For me, if I thoroughly enjoy listening to a song and would not have it changed, it works perfectly and meets all my requirements .. so why should I not say so? I personally find grading systems will always encourage some people to never give full marks, and have never understood this. As for eg when I ask managers who have graded a piece of work 9 out of 10 what could be done or changed to improve it, they say .. "Nothing. Its great. But I never give 10s"

I do

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Old 13 May 2012, 16:42   #20
White of High
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJLeen View Post
White of high : Is there 1 song that you DO like on that album ??????
I like a few songs. I think The Giving Tree and Live Or Die are nice songs but I could imagine better performance, better production of them. My main problem is Meat's raw voice in most of the songs and the simple 3-chords music.

HIAHB is the only album of Meat has no great songs to me. The entire album is average to me with a few very bad attempts. On HCTB I loved Song Of Madness, on Bat3 I loved Land Of The Pigs, on CHSIB I loved the title song, etc.

Answer to CarylB... I think give 10 to all songs is folly. Is Burning Down 10 to you? Or Wolf At Your Door, or Do It! is really 10 and good as For Crying Out Loud with big orchestra? I think lot of fan give10 because a fan has to give 10 to all songs of her/his idol. Fans control idols and if you don't criticize your idol you dig his tomb...
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Old 13 May 2012, 17:46   #21
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Answer to CarylB... I think give 10 to all songs is folly.
No more folly in my view than to never rate anything a 10.

I did not say I give all songs 10, I said that for me, if I thoroughly enjoy listening to a song and would not have it changed, it works perfectly and meets all my requirements .. When that is the case I rate 10.

Quote:
Is Burning Down 10 to you? Or Wolf At Your Door, or Do It! is really 10 and good as For Crying Out Loud with big orchestra?
I have not rated Burning Down, nor Wolf At Your Door. I did like Meat's version of Do It! very much indeed, and yes, would probably rate it a 10. For me it did exactly what it was meant to do. It does not, for me, have to be compared to FCOL with a big orchestra .. indeed, that would be folly to me, because it would immediately mean that many songs, however good or well delivered, might be rated lower in comparison rather than on their merits.

I do not compare songs. You don't see me posting what is my favourite track, or best track. Each has its place, its style, tempo and appeal. I consider them on how they appeal to me, not one against the other. I do not have "a favourite" Meat Loaf song .. except perhaps the one I'm listening to at any given time, because I enjoy hearing Meat sing, and value the effort that has gone into bringing it to me. This is even more the case for HCTB and HIAH, which to me are each a whole piece of work, with each song leading from and to the next, and that whole is greater than the sum of the parts. As was the case with CHSIB for me.

Ask me how I rate a song I will tell you, whether it is in accord with your view or not. Ask me to rate it in comparison to others and I will say that is generally impossible for me.

Quote:
I think lot of fan give10 because a fan has to give 10 to all songs of her/his idol. Fans control idols and if you don't criticize your idol you dig his tomb...
I have no idea what other fans' motivations are. I don't think you rating a song 2 or 3 digs his tomb, nor would it were I to dismiss any song like that. It is not why I rate songs I am absolutely happy with and would not seek change or "improvement" 10. I don't often listen to BA, BBIS, MATLF or Stoney & Meat Loaf. This is not because they are full of "bad songs", merely that these do not grab me as strongly as others, but that's about personal taste not an unbiased rating on the quality of the work, and I can enjoy listening to all of them. But times change, the world moves on, musically as well as in all other ways, and I have moved with it, my taste has evolved with it. Meat's current style is to me exciting, and of today. It touches me, grabs my attention and excites me as I am today, just as BOOH did back in the 70s and 80s.

That he continues to creatively explore new styles, push against barriers and cross into new territory is to me far more exciting than if he stayed with the same style. To me that's what makes him special, enduring and the performer he is. I was stunned when I first heard HCTB; swept away just as I was when I first heard BOOH. HIAH strikes a chord with me in 2012 that BOOH probably couldn't, although it certainly did in 1978, and I still love to hear him sing those songs. CHSIB did the same when it came out; gone was the youthful angst, these were the songs of late summer, from the perspective of a man who has been around the block of love and back, with a maturity I loved. But that's how it should be imo, and for me it is. Over the years some of his explorations have not been as exciting as when BOOH was unleashed, but CHSIB was, and now HCTB and HIAH are for me .. in spades! He promised a new adventure, and for me he is delivering it 100% .. or 10 out of 10

Caryl
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Old 13 May 2012, 20:37   #22
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Is Burning Down 10 to you? Or Wolf At Your Door, or Do It! is really 10 and good as For Crying Out Loud with big orchestra?
Art is subjective...there is no "right" or "wrong" only what appeals to the consumer. Wolf At Your Door is a spectacular song with a cunning message. To me and my ear, it is quite a remarkable piece. For Crying Out Loud is a remarkable piece as well, but the orchestra does not drive it over the top. It is the passion of Meat Loaf's voice. It does not take overdone and drawn out production to make a great song to my ear, it may to yours.
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Old 13 May 2012, 22:54   #23
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Originally Posted by White of High View Post
I think give 10 to all songs is folly.
I agree with you on this. If all songs are a 10 to you then you can't be objective. No matter who you are.

As for low or high ratings. It's very personal. Either you love, for example, the Steinman/Loaf combination so much that other songs have a hard time to match that, or you love the way that Meat has chosen a new direction. Away from his older style.

There is no wrong or right in giving high or low grates. Although I believe that giving 1's or 10's is always over the top.

With a 1 you're basically saying that NOTHING is right about a song.
With a 10 you're saying "This is PERFRECT" and can't be improved in any way.

I doubt both ratings every time I see it. Then again, for one or two songs a rating like this could be possible. But ratings like that should be rare
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Old 13 May 2012, 23:23   #24
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As far as I recall they only differ from each other with regard to one word. Meat Loaf sings "began to pray" instead of "pretend to pray". The original line is more interesting, in my opinion.
hi sarge,
i didn't mean that, but as meat says california dreaming is not a happy holiday song, ... it is about fear and someone not following his dreams ...
i meant the whole meaning of the song.
that's my point.
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Old 13 May 2012, 23:49   #25
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There is no wrong or right in giving high or low grates. Although I believe that giving 1's or 10's is always over the top.
Which is what I've heard so many managers say over the years .. and in effect it reduces the range used to 2-9 .. and if you make it a 2-9 scale they avoid giving nines!

Quote:
With a 10 you're saying "This is PERFRECT" and can't be improved in any way.
And as I said, if I cannot see how it could be made better for ME, then for me it requires no improvement and 10 is what I give

Quote:
But ratings like that should be rare
And Meat is a rare performer in my view BOOH was a landmark album and most of the songs I seem to recall got scores of 9+ I'm not going to fiddle around with 9.6s, or 9.75s for the sake of avoiding 10 .. For me, HCTB and HIAH are landmark albums. So 10s seem just right

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