Best Live Release? - Page 2

duke knooby · 02 Jun 2010, 00:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evil One

I don't have a problem with feedback

lol, yeah you did... but meat kept it constructive and positive

or attacking and personal... i cant rem

glamourgirl · 02 Jun 2010, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evil One

I also haven't bought 3 Bats Live CD and also suspect it would be shite.
The Casa De Carne CD is very good. Anything For Love sounds a bit shaky, but the rest is all above average.

Did you think Meat's vocals were shaky on AFL? Patti sounded better than ever. The Casa cd isn't my favorite because Paul's guitar is mixed too loudly over the backing vocals. And some of the best songs were omitted from the cd- Bad For Good, Dead Ringer, Bible and a Beer, Paradise.

I agree with Radiomaster. Best live cd-LATW; Best live dvd-MSO
However, if The History of Meat Loaf Live, Live in the Neighborhood, and Hard Rock Live were ever released on dvd, I might have a new favorite dvd.
With 3 Bats Live, I wish I had saved my money.

StuE2 · 03 Jun 2010, 16:35

I guess I can't mention b--tl--gs but I wanna agree with Evil One about how they do contain better stuff than the official releases. Look at the tracklist for Live then compare it to the setlist from the actual shows. It does not compare at all. It's like how long have I (we) waited for something official from the original Bat tour? It's not just about being a completist to hunt out every version of a song but about actually getting full shows on either audio or video as a pure document of Meat Loaf's music career. Speaking of which I think I'll start a thread about the '88 tour....

Evil One · 03 Jun 2010, 18:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by glamourgirl

if The History of Meat Loaf Live, Live in the Neighborhood, and Hard Rock Live were ever released on dvd, I might have a new favorite dvd.

I agree with this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuE2

but I wanna agree with Evil One

This sort of behaviour could get you into all sorts of trouble!

Wario · 03 Jun 2010, 21:49

what meat needs to let happen is let me, Andy, Neil, RJ, and evil one go through his stash of soundboards and video recordings.

He should give us a chance to produce/edit them the way we see fit.

Bottom Line: You wont be disjointedness in what we decide to release

Most likely we'd cut BOOH, 2/3, Paradise, and AFL from these shows to make room for some grade A quality performances of uncommon treasures.

Gotta say a real real real good version of took the words has yet to be officially released.

duke knooby · 04 Jun 2010, 02:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarioLoaf

what meat needs to let happen is let me, Andy, Neil, RJ, and evil one go through his stash of soundboards and video recordings.

He should give us a chance to produce/edit them the way we see fit.

Bottom Line: You wont be disjointedness in what we decide to release

Most likely we'd cut BOOH, 2/3, Paradise, and AFL from these shows to make room for some grade A quality performances of uncommon treasures.

Gotta say a real real real good version of took the words has yet to be officially released.

i'm gonna question youre judgement...

Wario · 04 Jun 2010, 08:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by duke knooby

i'm gonna question youre judgement...

Everyone does

Evil One · 04 Jun 2010, 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by glamourgirl

The Casa cd isn't my favorite because Paul's guitar is mixed too loudly over the backing vocals.

I agree about the guitar, although it's still better than the one Kasim produced for CHSIB.

Wario · 04 Jun 2010, 22:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evil One

I agree about the guitar, although it's still better than the one Kasim produced for CHSIB.

mabey cause his bass was mixed to high above everything else and made the cd sound like crap.

madagascar · 06 Jun 2010, 04:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarioLoaf

mabey cause his bass was mixed to high above everything else and made the cd sound like crap.

Nevertheless this recording appeals to me in a different way, but it definitely does.

Smithie · 07 Jun 2010, 18:54

That's why band members shouldn't produce or mix live cds. Whatever instrument they play is always mixed too loudly. I also agree that whoever mixed the backing vocals on the Casa tour cd did an awful job. Even on Why Don't We Do It In the Road, when Patti's singing, what happened to her "why" at the beginning of her solo? And where are her backing vocals on 2 Out of 3 and Bat? I saw those shows and you could distinctly hear her backing vocals.

batoutofhell · 07 Jun 2010, 19:31

The person who really needs to produce or mix live CDs is the guy they had running the sound at the shows, someone who likely helped record one or more of the gigs for archiving or potential release. He's the person who knows which shows sounded better vocally, which ones had awesome-tastic guitar solos, where the drums did a better fill on a certain night, because he has to regulate the sound mix and pays attention to every element during a given show. For the ultimate live experience on a CD, we need to start letting the sound crew assemble it, and if the band has to go back in and re-do some stuff it doesn't like, they will know how best to insert it.

[/end mini rant]

**allrevvedup** · 07 Jun 2010, 19:49

and I agree with what you're saying in theory but a lot of live albums are not fully recorded live but have studio overdubs worked on in the studio afterwards.

I would say it's cheaper for the likes of Kasim and Paul to mix and produce a live cd then the likes of David Thoener and when this is a free gift (as such) as an add on for HCTB then they will do it with a minimum budget and timeframe.

*AndyK* · 07 Jun 2010, 21:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by batoutofhell

The person who really needs to produce or mix live CDs is the guy they had running the sound at the shows, someone who likely helped record one or more of the gigs for archiving or potential release. He's the person who knows which shows sounded better vocally, which ones had awesome-tastic guitar solos, where the drums did a better fill on a certain night, because he has to regulate the sound mix and pays attention to every element during a given show. For the ultimate live experience on a CD, we need to start letting the sound crew assemble it, and if the band has to go back in and re-do some stuff it doesn't like, they will know how best to insert it.

[/end mini rant]

Which is what happened with the CdC Live disc ... George being that man

batoutofhell · 08 Jun 2010, 19:40

So why involve a band member in the process as well if (as we've seen with Kas and Paul) they'll mix their contributions to the fore? Just let George do it.

Steingirl · 09 Jun 2010, 00:34

"Dead Ringer For Love" at the Ohio show was one of the best vocal performances I heard on the CDC tour. I'm surprised the song wasn't included on the live album.

Julie in the rv mirror · 09 Jun 2010, 02:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarioLoaf

Bottom Line: You wont be disjointedness in what we decide to release

This will always happen when you do compilations, IMO. The key is to find the best show, and release it intact.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarioLoaf

Most likely we'd cut BOOH, 2/3, Paradise, and AFL from these shows to make room for some grade A quality performances of uncommon treasures.

Of course, you are a diehard, so you would say that. To cut those songs would destroy the integrity of the setlist (not to mention the legacy). Again- best complete show*. Then tack on your rarities as "bonus tracks".

*Edit to say that I think this is one reason why, um, you know, "footwear" often sounds better.

batoutofhell · 09 Jun 2010, 20:41

While I agree with you, Julie, crowd noise is just the same as any other crowd noise. Let's say that this is a recording of the tour's best gig, but there were three other shows where he did a song that never appeared again. Shouldn't we be able to edit that in?

Evil One · 09 Jun 2010, 21:11

As long as everything sounds roughly the same I see no issue with compiling the best from each show on a tour. For example I would rather have the 'best' Dead Ringer as opposed to an average version from an otherwise great show.

batoutofhell · 09 Jun 2010, 21:21

I'm a perfectionist nut job, but I dare say I'd even go back to all the tapes of the tour and select the best guitar solo, the best drum track, etc., for each song. Piecemeal it may well be, but it will kick some righteous ass to hear a meticulously assembled live track.

*AndyK* · 09 Jun 2010, 21:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by batoutofhell

I'm a perfectionist nut job, but I dare say I'd even go back to all the tapes of the tour and select the best guitar solo, the best drum track, etc., for each song. Piecemeal it may well be, but it will kick some righteous ass to hear a meticulously assembled live track.

You'd lose the essence of "live" though, there's nothng wrong with fixing the major flaws, but a live recording should capture the feel of the live show, warts and all in my opinion.

Julie in the rv mirror · 10 Jun 2010, 08:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyK

You'd lose the essence of "live" though, there's nothng wrong with fixing the major flaws, but a live recording should capture the feel of the live show, warts and all in my opinion.

Absolutely agree; which is why I say I prefer a complete show as opposed to a compilation, although I see your points about picking the best performances. And yes, while crowd noise is crowd noise, some shows just have a certain "vibe" that is unique to that show, if you know what I mean.

And no, we shouldn't be deprived of exceptional performances, so again- bonus tracks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by batoutofhell

I'm a perfectionist nut job, but I dare say I'd even go back to all the tapes of the tour and select the best guitar solo, the best drum track, etc., for each song. Piecemeal it may well be, but it will kick some righteous ass to hear a meticulously assembled live track.

It probably would kick ass, but it's not really live anymore, it's Memorex.

Frank Zappa used to do stuff like that. Some of his "studio" tracks were actually live performances with lots of overdubs, or he'd pick out a drum part here, a guitar solo there (from completely different songs), and put them together. Cool stuff!

Smithie · 10 Jun 2010, 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyK

You'd lose the essence of "live" though, there's nothng wrong with fixing the major flaws, but a live recording should capture the feel of the live show, warts and all in my opinion.

I couldn't agree more. It's fine to fix a missed note here or there, but don't remix entire songs. I want to hear the true live experience.

**allrevvedup** · 10 Jun 2010, 17:41

I think there would be a lot more negative reviews for live albums if that were the case (not that I'm saying I wouldn't like to see more of it)

A case in point of how we've been conditioned to live albums sounding, for me anyway, was the stereophonics live from dakota which didn't have any additional mixing bar the soundboard there and then and to be honest I thought it sounded very poor overall.

As I say it's something we've been conditioned to and most artists really want a live album to sound near perfect so that it'll attract listeners to come and see them on the next tour.

03 Jun 2010, 16:35	#28
StuE2 Rookie Join Date: 30.05.2010 Location: Durham Uk-Land Posts: 11	I guess I can't mention b--tl--gs but I wanna agree with Evil One about how they do contain better stuff than the official releases. Look at the tracklist for Live then compare it to the setlist from the actual shows. It does not compare at all. It's like how long have I (we) waited for something official from the original Bat tour? It's not just about being a completist to hunt out every version of a song but about actually getting full shows on either audio or video as a pure document of Meat Loaf's music career. Speaking of which I think I'll start a thread about the '88 tour....

03 Jun 2010, 21:49	#30
Wario Monstro helps me spell things... Join Date: 05.01.2007 Location: Masculine, Pennsylvania Posts: 9,105	what meat needs to let happen is let me, Andy, Neil, RJ, and evil one go through his stash of soundboards and video recordings. He should give us a chance to produce/edit them the way we see fit. Bottom Line: You wont be disjointedness in what we decide to release Most likely we'd cut BOOH, 2/3, Paradise, and AFL from these shows to make room for some grade A quality performances of uncommon treasures. Gotta say a real real real good version of took the words has yet to be officially released.

07 Jun 2010, 18:54	#36
Smithie Super Loafer Join Date: 11.08.2009 Posts: 756	That's why band members shouldn't produce or mix live cds. Whatever instrument they play is always mixed too loudly. I also agree that whoever mixed the backing vocals on the Casa tour cd did an awful job. Even on Why Don't We Do It In the Road, when Patti's singing, what happened to her "why" at the beginning of her solo? And where are her backing vocals on 2 Out of 3 and Bat? I saw those shows and you could distinctly hear her backing vocals.

07 Jun 2010, 19:31	#37
batoutofhell Junior Loafer Join Date: 22.05.2010 Location: In a house. Obviously. Posts: 38	The person who really needs to produce or mix live CDs is the guy they had running the sound at the shows, someone who likely helped record one or more of the gigs for archiving or potential release. He's the person who knows which shows sounded better vocally, which ones had awesome-tastic guitar solos, where the drums did a better fill on a certain night, because he has to regulate the sound mix and pays attention to every element during a given show. For the ultimate live experience on a CD, we need to start letting the sound crew assemble it, and if the band has to go back in and re-do some stuff it doesn't like, they will know how best to insert it. [/end mini rant]

07 Jun 2010, 19:49	#38
allrevvedup "Most things that i worry about, never happen anyway" Join Date: 29.11.2003 Location: Liverpool Posts: 5,358	and I agree with what you're saying in theory but a lot of live albums are not fully recorded live but have studio overdubs worked on in the studio afterwards. I would say it's cheaper for the likes of Kasim and Paul to mix and produce a live cd then the likes of David Thoener and when this is a free gift (as such) as an add on for HCTB then they will do it with a minimum budget and timeframe.

08 Jun 2010, 19:40	#40
batoutofhell Junior Loafer Join Date: 22.05.2010 Location: In a house. Obviously. Posts: 38	So why involve a band member in the process as well if (as we've seen with Kas and Paul) they'll mix their contributions to the fore? Just let George do it.

09 Jun 2010, 00:34	#41
Steingirl Super Loafer Join Date: 21.04.2008 Posts: 309	"Dead Ringer For Love" at the Ohio show was one of the best vocal performances I heard on the CDC tour. I'm surprised the song wasn't included on the live album.

09 Jun 2010, 20:41	#43
batoutofhell Junior Loafer Join Date: 22.05.2010 Location: In a house. Obviously. Posts: 38	While I agree with you, Julie, crowd noise is just the same as any other crowd noise. Let's say that this is a recording of the tour's best gig, but there were three other shows where he did a song that never appeared again. Shouldn't we be able to edit that in?

09 Jun 2010, 21:11	#44
Evil One Mega Loafer Join Date: 15.01.2007 Posts: 5,193	As long as everything sounds roughly the same I see no issue with compiling the best from each show on a tour. For example I would rather have the 'best' Dead Ringer as opposed to an average version from an otherwise great show.

09 Jun 2010, 21:21	#45
batoutofhell Junior Loafer Join Date: 22.05.2010 Location: In a house. Obviously. Posts: 38	I'm a perfectionist nut job, but I dare say I'd even go back to all the tapes of the tour and select the best guitar solo, the best drum track, etc., for each song. Piecemeal it may well be, but it will kick some righteous ass to hear a meticulously assembled live track.

10 Jun 2010, 17:41	#49
allrevvedup "Most things that i worry about, never happen anyway" Join Date: 29.11.2003 Location: Liverpool Posts: 5,358	I think there would be a lot more negative reviews for live albums if that were the case (not that I'm saying I wouldn't like to see more of it) A case in point of how we've been conditioned to live albums sounding, for me anyway, was the stereophonics live from dakota which didn't have any additional mixing bar the soundboard there and then and to be honest I thought it sounded very poor overall. As I say it's something we've been conditioned to and most artists really want a live album to sound near perfect so that it'll attract listeners to come and see them on the next tour.