Meat's posts

[suzieq]

Originally Posted by tink

... because what happened yesterday upset folks and they want to express their concerns about it ...

i but i'd like to see this discussion thread remain to be a guide for others... treat the man kindly ... and don't mock those who love him ... be constructive with your criticism ... peace out ...

Yes. Wholeheartedly agree here. This thread should remain as a measuring stick. I'm not afraid to tell a newbie WHY it's here or what happened if they were to ask. I will gladly tell newbies who asked what happened; "Welcome to the forum or I know you are new to the forum and may have missed some information. BUT, some member decided to post on every page something negative about a much anticipated album which half the world didn't have yet and they were pissing on someones HCTB parade. Furthermore, Meat got upset about this abusive jackass and called him out. The problem was swept under the rug and the fans who were tired of being pissed on were upset that they didn't get to see their Knight in shining armor's posts. Meat stands up for himself, so let this be a guide as to what makes him tick."

What's the worse thing that can happen? I make a new friend. and confirm a person for what they really are trying to do here.

Originally Posted by CarylB

I'd like to see a clear statement on this site of how fortunate we are to have Meat post here and how he should be treated, something which goes beyond "the rules" because he is not "just a member" and will always be prey to those who like to poke the stick.

Caryl

Ditto for me like I said before, guest of honor.

Originally Posted by nikox1

type 3 is the sit on the fence people/sweep everything under the rug people?

lets enjoy ourselves on here, and get this forum back to the way it was

Problems don't go away if you sweep them under a rug.

The forum is fine as a whole....this thread is the only thing that has taken a stand since Meats thread has been locked....and this thread is worthwhile to have.

[nikox1]

Originally Posted by suzieq

Yes. Wholeheartedly agree here. This thread should remain as a measuring stick. I'm not afraid to tell a newbie WHY it's here or what happened if they were to ask. I will gladly tell newbies who asked what happened; "Welcome to the forum or I know you are new to the forum and may have missed some information. BUT, some member decided to post on every page something negative about a much anticipated album which half the world didn't have yet and they were pissing on someones HCTB parade. Furthermore, Meat got upset about this abusive jackass and called him out. The problem was swept under the rug and the fans who were tired of being pissed on were upset that they didn't get to see their Knight in shining armor's posts. Meat stands up for himself, so let this be a guide as to what makes him tick."

What's the worse thing that can happen? I make a new friend. and confirm a person for what they really are trying to do here.




Ditto for me like I said before, guest of honor.




Problems don't go away if you sweep them under a rug.

The forum is fine as a whole....this thread is the only thing that has taken a stand since Meats thread has been locked....and this thread is worthwhile to have.

i agree, i posted it all above!! i said all i have to say on the matter!!

[Sarge]

Meanwhile I have listened to two Meat Loaf albums while having a glass of French red wine and Belgian chocolate. Maybe I'm just lazy, maybe I believe that being concerned with useless arguments (of past, present and future ) that lead nowhere just consumes too much precious time and energy that should rather be used for something nice, useful, creative or constructive.

[suzieq]

Originally Posted by Sarge

Meanwhile I have listened to two Meat Loaf albums while having a glass of French red wine and Belgian chocolate. Maybe I'm just lazy, maybe I believe that being concerned with useless arguments (of past, present and future ) that lead nowhere just consumes too much precious time and energy that should rather be used for something nice, useful, creative or constructive.

Pretty lucky to have all that 1 hour and 42 minutes of precious time to yourself (because that was the time difference between your last two useless points and posts on this thread)....I'd say you made good use of your time with a couple of Meatie albums that usually span more than an hour each (wait you must have skipped a few tracks) and consuming your treats .

Sorry for my delay of 3 hours between my posts, but you know....I wasn't doing anything nice, useful, creative, or constructive with my life......

[Vickip]

And I watched the Phillies win the baseball game
But that doesn't make this thread any less important in my mind ... it's been
a great discussion. People have been making a lot of valid points that could
be very helpful to new members of the forum.

[Sarge]

Originally Posted by suzieq

wait you must have skipped a few tracks

I admit to have done that. (Oh, I'm bad...)

[Megan]

Quiet Newbie here... I go back to a thread what it means to be a fan and this being a fan site. Of course EVERYONE is entitled to their opinions, that's what makes it interesting to read. This is a Fan site.. I find it amazing that Meat comes on to posts and interact with the fans.... WOW how many artists would do such a thing?! I look forward to his posts, that is part of the reason i joined the site and that friends told me it was a great fan site. I find it sad he needs to come on here and defend himself. He has stated he is all for constructive criticism. Don't attack his integrity that is just wrong.

To the moderators of the site.. why does this person who attacks Meat still have an account or can post ... can this person not just get a read only restrictions? I'm not sure of the forum rules. (this is a question not an attack to you or the site) Can Meat or other members request such actions and you do them based on a certain number of complaints? (obviously not one person complaint)

I would have liked to have seen the back and forth to cheer Meat. I respect and am happy he comes on and does that. I hope he is not so annoyed that he won't be back. Like others have said he is the Guest of Honor for this Fan site and should be treated with respect.

[Vickip]

Originally Posted by Megan

Quiet Newbie here... I go back to a thread what it means to be a fan and this being a fan site. Of course EVERYONE is entitled to their opinions, that's what makes it interesting to read. This is a Fan site.. I find it amazing that Meat comes on to posts and interact with the fans.... WOW how many artists would do such a thing?! I look forward to his posts, that is part of the reason i joined the site and that friends told me it was a great fan site. I find it sad he needs to come on here and defend himself. He has stated he is all for constructive criticism. Don't attack his integrity that is just wrong.

To the moderators of the site.. why does this person who attacks Meat still have an account or can post ... can this person not just get a read only restrictions? I'm not sure of the forum rules. (this is a question not an attack to you or the site) Can Meat or other members request such actions and you do them based on a certain number of complaints? (obviously not one person complaint)

I would have liked to have seen the back and forth to cheer Meat. I respect and am happy he comes on and does that. I hope he is not so annoyed that he won't be back. Like others have said he is the Guest of Honor for this Fan site and should be treated with respect.

Very well said Megan

[A Slice Of English]

Can I just say that technically, Meat owes me a new keyboard because one of his comments in that thread made me spit my Pepsi onto it in shock and laughter...

[carole]

Originally Posted by CarylB

As I don't know why the thread was removed I wouldn't call for it being put back. I agreed with pretty much everything Meat posted, and also that he had a right to call out what was going on.

I continually find it bizarre that when people call for respect to be shown towards Meat there will be some who define that as worshipping or ass-kissing. Meat IS different, he is the performer this site is about for heavens sake, and just because he is interested and approachable enough to come here and talk to us does not mean imo he should be regarded as "just one of the members". It's to most of us an honour and a joy that he comes here, and he should imo be treated with honour.

Like you, I am equally annoyed when I see posts being made repeatedly with the sole intention of bringing the mood down, or as Emma has said with the apparent motive of getting Meat's attention .. the squeaky wheel syndrome. It bothers Meat too as you say, and it was time it was addressed .. and I do agree with Kathy that the one person who should be able to do this, if it's not prevented, is Meat. He spoke for many of us when he posted yesterday. "Freedom of speech" is such an abused term and used too often imo as a shield for behaviour which is rude or disrespectful.

But I can also see that whilst the thread might have sent a message to those here who indulge in that behaviour, to newcomers it could easily be open to misinterpretation, given we have the rather daft situation where Meat can't use his own name. People often take a while to accept that this IS Meat posting, and when they don't know the background that's led up to what took place yesterday, it could look very strange.

Personally I would have liked a clear statement on the forum when this was removed that the behaviour that provoked it is not acceptable, that Meat is honoured here and deserves respect. That if you don't like some of his work you may of course say this but should do so politely, with respect for his feelings. Meat doesn't expect everyone to like everything, and has no problem with that, but do not attack his motives, his character, his person. That if you don't like anything he does you should consider not coming here because what is the point? This is a forum for those who appreciate him. And that it is not acceptable to dismiss those who do, nor indeed those who who do unconditionally because they love him, in negative terms like "sucking up" or "ass kissing". Fansites will have many who do indeed love and worship the performer, and if you can't understand that then at least don't ridicule it or try and bring their mood down.

No-one, not Meat nor us, should have to develop a "thick skin" to post here. Meat has feelings, as do we. There's no justification for rudeness or comments intended to hurt anyone's feelings, belittle them, or belittle Meat's work.

Caryl

Very well put Caryl. Meat isn't just another member here, it is his site and I consider it an honour that he posts on here, and it saddens me when he is reduced to having to defend himself, especially when the person in question is supposed to be a fan of his. I was on line while it all unfolded and saw everything that was written and Meat was well within his rights to be upset and say what he did. It's a sad state of affairs when you come onto your own fan site and are attacked. I agree with what a few others have said here, not everyone has to like everything he does, he does not expect it either. But if you don't like something, say it politely and respectfully. Meat has feelings too. He welcomes constructive criticism and takes it on board.

Carole

[daveake]

I have a question. Is this about the thread Evil One started or is this something I've missed?

[carole]

Yeah it's about the one Evil One started the other day.

Carole

[daveake]

TVM

[Monstro]

It's early and I'll probably word this wrong but here goes.....

It took me ages to actually grasp the reality of this site and to this day there are posts that piss me off or I think were written by a complete idiot but it's how I react that's changed. The truth is this isn't Meat's site, it isn't .net, it's an independant fan club run by the fans for the fans, not for the artist.

I agree that it's brilliant Meat chooses to post here (if he didn't I wouldn't have gone to the London listening party) but I also like the fact that not every post has to be I love it, it's brilliant etc etc. Opposing viewpoints are welcomed here, not all fans are going to love everything Meat does, personally I hated Popstar to Operastar and laughed out loud at the BOOH arrangement. Saying that though I think Meat was right, continuosly poking at something is wrong but the thread the way it went was wrong, whilst some think that Meat should be allowed to posts whatever he wants is right, I don't. Personally I don't want to see someone I've admired and followed for donkey's years reduce himself to the level of those just trying to wind him up, Meat called him out and said what many thought and that's where he should've left it, as stated earlier in this thread it turned into a battle not a discussion so it was right it was removed and I'd like to think in the cold light of day Meat would agree with that.

[daveake]

(Well, it's better than "CHSIB"!)

[allrevvedup]

Originally Posted by Monstro

It's early and I'll probably word this wrong but here goes.....

It took me ages to actually grasp the reality of this site and to this day there are posts that piss me off or I think were written by a complete idiot but it's how I react that's changed. The truth is this isn't Meat's site, it isn't .net, it's an independant fan club run by the fans for the fans, not for the artist.

I agree that it's brilliant Meat chooses to post here (if he didn't I wouldn't have gone to the London listening party) but I also like the fact that not every post has to be I love it, it's brilliant etc etc. Opposing viewpoints are welcomed here, not all fans are going to love everything Meat does, personally I hated Popstar to Operastar and laughed out loud at the BOOH arrangement. Saying that though I think Meat was right, continuosly poking at something is wrong but the thread the way it went was wrong, whilst some think that Meat should be allowed to posts whatever he wants is right, I don't. Personally I don't want to see someone I've admired and followed for donkey's years reduce himself to the level of those just trying to wind him up, Meat called him out and said what many thought and that's where he should've left it, as stated earlier in this thread it turned into a battle not a discussion so it was right it was removed and I'd like to think in the cold light of day Meat would agree with that.

Nothing more to add to that really...sums it up nicely

[TheDoode]

Stop me if you've heard this one:

A Steven Spielberg fan opens a bar and it's the coolest place in town. He even calls it "Speilberg's" (he's not that creative). Everyone who likes Spielberg goes there to hang out and talk the talk. And then one day the man himself shows up, takes in a Bud, and hangs out for a while with a bunch of likeminded people.

A regular occurence, it's like everything's going great, and Spielberg amuses with stories and news of his life and career, and the people, being Spielberg fans, are all sitting there with dumb grins on their faces thinking 'this is great! we get a chance to talk to Spielberg'. And that's when one loud, obnoxious drunk raises his voice in the background...

At first Steven doesn't react. He's professional, he's cool, he lets it slide. But the drunk gets louder, obnoxious even, and suddenly he's attracted the attention of other like-minded drunks. Now Steven, mid-way through a timeless anecdote with a bunch of fans hanging on his every word, is visibly shaken by what's going on.

An hour passes, it escalates further, and Steven finds that he's being scrutinised about things he knows damn well he never even did! And he's getting mad! And he feels attacked, and of course he does - because we'd all react pretty much like that in the same circumstance, right? Right.

I'm just saying...

Doode.

[daveake]

I see no loud, obnoxious drunks.

I do see someone who wants to censor people's opinions.

[TheDoode]

Cool, point him out to me next time he's in Because right now I'll tell you that I don't like Wolf at your Door because it's way too poppy and doesn't really sound like Meat, I do like Elvis in Vegas because it's a kick-ass tune, and I'm still not entirely sure about FCOL as the best track of all time (though it WOULD be right up there).

Daveake, you back up 90% of Evil One's posts here, so I'm not even going to carry this on. You know my thoughts, and I can see yours coming a mile off. As long as people go around offending each other and angering the artiste (which is what this is all about, so go on, tell me that DIDN'T happen) then this will be my stance until it stops. Cencorship is the banner the cowards hide behind when they've been called out.

[CarylB]

Originally Posted by Monstro

It's early and I'll probably word this wrong but here goes.....

Not at all .. good post

I think pretty much everyone has agreed here that not all fans will like everything, that not all posts need to be about loving every piece of Meat's work, and that Meat and they have no problem with with that provided it's done with respect. But as you say, the continuous poking and prodding that provoked what happened is wrong. And the back and forth one-liners on the HCTB Experience thread that morning which were later removed, proved to be a final and tasteless straw. Perhaps intended to wind up the many who have embraced the album with delight, they were an insult not only to them but to Meat.

I think most of us arguing that Meat should be treated differently here, are simply saying that he should always be accorded respect, and given the latitude to call people out when they repeatedly try and bait him or pour cold water on the enthusiasm most of his fans have for his work, and in so doing say what so many are thinking. I too hate to see people winding him up in efforts to antagonise him and reduce him to their level. I'm certainly not arguing that the thread should be reinstated for the reasons I've already said, and yes, it became finally a battle ... imo simply because when the biter was bit he refused to accept he'd been called out and drop it. I have no idea whether Meat would or would not want the thread reinstated; for all I know he could have asked for its removal, could have agreed to it. He made his stand and I'm sure moved quickly on to deal with far more important things.

But he did say what many here were thinking. Most of us are full of excitement and enthusiasm for his new album. Let those who aren't say so and leave it at that. Let those who are, do what you might reasonably expect fans to do on a fansite .. celebrate and share Meat's obvious pride in what he's produced .. and do it without continued harrying by those who don't.

Caryl

[daveake]

Originally Posted by TheDoode

stuff

I've lost count of the number of posts where you've told people what they can't say. Can you see why that might annoy people?

[daveake]

Originally Posted by CarylB

Let those who aren't say so and leave it at that. Let those who are, do what you might reasonably expect fans to do on a fansite .. celebrate and share Meat's obvious pride in what he's produced .. and do it without continued harrying by those who don't.

I do hope that you're not saying that those who don't like the album are allowed to say so once and then have to shut up, whilst those that do like are given free reign to say so as often as they like.

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by Monstro

It took me ages to actually grasp the reality of this site and to this day there are posts that piss me off or I think were written by a complete idiot but it's how I react that's changed. The truth is this isn't Meat's site, it isn't .net, it's an independant fan club run by the fans for the fans, not for the artist.

I agree that it's brilliant Meat chooses to post here (if he didn't I wouldn't have gone to the London listening party) but I also like the fact that not every post has to be I love it, it's brilliant etc etc. Opposing viewpoints are welcomed here, not all fans are going to love everything Meat does, personally I hated Popstar to Operastar and laughed out loud at the BOOH arrangement. Saying that though I think Meat was right, continuosly poking at something is wrong but the thread the way it went was wrong, whilst some think that Meat should be allowed to posts whatever he wants is right, I don't. Personally I don't want to see someone I've admired and followed for donkey's years reduce himself to the level of those just trying to wind him up.

yup.

[TheDoode]

Originally Posted by daveake

I've lost count of the number of posts where you've told people what they can't say. Can you see why that might annoy people?

Daveake,

Save it. I've seen the the disrespectful shit that you and Evil One post on your 'Bat Musical' forum. It's not about me, so don't even go there. If you have the right to trash things, then I have the right to defend them.

Doode.

[CarylB]

Originally Posted by daveake

I do hope that you're not saying that those who don't like the album are allowed to say so once and then have to shut up, whilst those that do like are given free reign to say so as often as they like.

I meant precisely what I said. And I credit you with more than enough intellect to know exactly what I (and others who have said essentially the same) mean.

Most of us are full of excitement and enthusiasm for his new album. Let those who aren't say so and leave it at that. Let those who are, do what you might reasonably expect fans to do on a fansite .. celebrate and share Meat's obvious pride in what he's produced .. and do it without continued harrying by those who don't.

You've made it perfecty clear you don't like the album. Fine. Your point is made. But on a fansite the many fans who love it will want to continue to enthuse about it without being harried by the kind of repeated mocking comments which were removed from the HCTB Experience thread yesterday.

Caryl