Last At Bat Videos
 

Not sure if anyone's seen these yet, but there's two complete sets up from London and Germany. They're on the usual site - if you search by date added you should find them. But hurry ... while stocks last...

I'm sure they won't be there for long. I have seen them and it just irritates me that we haven't had an official release yet. :shrug:

I'm more interested in a release where Meat gets to rest his voice and temper his performance. I'll gladly skip the Last at Bat stuff if Vegas and lack of touring country-to-country works out better for his voice :-)

As long as we get Running For The Red Light, The Giving Tree, the new arrangements of Dead Ringer and Frying Pan and the whole of Bat 1 in order on a DVD then I agree with you. :lol:

It still hurts my ears. :(

grab it while its there is my motto :-P

Crank it really loud with headphones for the true concert experience. might hurt a little for some of the ones with iffy sound quality, but overall some of the LAB concerts are very very good when I do it like this. I've found that with Meat's recent performances, including HIAHB, blast it to hear the full power in his voice and all the emphasis he adds for conveying the emotion of the moment.

Totally agree tho, I'd pass on this as a DVD (especially with the amazing bootlegs out there) for a time in the future where Meat's had a chance to rest his voice like he did before HCTB Tour....Seems like he's been working like crazy since then and his voice has taken a toll....Still a great show tho :cool:

What site? Lol

Sorry, no links allowed

They were magnificent shows, and I'm so glad I had the opportunity to see a couple of them live in person!

whoa....srsly? I posted a link to download videos from youtube, as well as songs. This is NOT a bootleg link at all!!!!

for anyone interested....if you google for sites to download videos off of a video service online such as vimeo, youtube, etc there are many places to do this to save your memories for yourself. This is not a bootleg url....

srsly...:roll:

As my son would say..

Obvious Troll is Obvious!

London seems like the best of the three that are up (in terms of vocals and sound quality), or so it seems after flicking through them very quickly to decide which one to download before they vanish.

I'm surprised at how in depth the stuff on the screens are, I haven't seen any videos of it that I remember. Very well done.

last at bat was awsome

Can be... but still hurts too much. And I don't talk about the sound quality. :oops:

Sadly I agree with White of High on this one.

Its a voice that needs a caveat preceding it or has to be 'taken in context'. :(

Hey, I would just like to say thank you very very much for letting me know about this. This was what I suspect will be my last ever Meat Loaf concert, and I actually made my own audio rceording of it which I have listened to many times since. But then disaster struck and I lost the file by accident, I was so sad and upset that I can't tell you. But now I have the chance again to relive this great great night that will always stay with me. Thank you so so much for letting me get another recording of my last show.

I don't think your a troll dude, and I'm glad you said how you feel. I'm kind of torn between being happy these shows happened and what you said. I mean as long as Meat's happy, I'm glad, but I find them hard to listen to sometimes too...and that makes me very sad. But I'd still go and see him again because he's always changing it up and his voice changes each tour....Probably have to go for at least multiple shows to make sure its not like seattle....I was kinda choked at that one. I drove there myself, took forever, and then the show was just not the same as the hang cool tour...Not sure if i'd wanna do that again u know?

I have never been to a show and I have no chance to get one. When I was young, I had no money. Now I have money but I'm very far from Europe or the states. Nothing left but youtube. I don't talk about shows, I can imagine the show was great. But show, performance and singing are different on their own way...

apparently I am the only person left that does not know where this site is. blast :(

The clue's in your own link, at the bottom of the your posts.

thanks :-)

Thou Shalt Not Spaketh The Name :twisted:

Does it start with Y and end in ube?:??::-)

i can neither confirm nor deny that :twisted: :-P

...trying super hard not to make a joke about the ube part :lol:

whoever posted those is an idiot. Take them down. Its against the mans wishes and you know that very damn well. Its videos like that Meat has a mild hatred for YT.

says the guy who has a channel dedicated to his live performances :|

He said it was fine to post them once the tour was over..

That channel goes through a Censor. Nothing current and nothing he doesn't want up is up on it.

Where did he say this? If so, the links would be allowed to be posted onto the site with no problem. If he said that Caryl and a bunch of others would watch it, cause that would mean these videos have meats seal of approval.

The reaction from posts in this thread like from an administer raise a red flag:

If anyone would remember Meat saying that, an Admin would. And links would be allowed if meat said these videos were ok.

What a pile of bullshit. The link Monstro removed was for a Youtube downloader program. The videos haven't been posted here as that is a quick way of getting them Red Ponied, however I'm sure if enough noise is made then that pony will come galloping along. :roll:

Also, since when have 'Caryl and a bunch of others' been the centre of the universe?

Well Meat said this about the LAB videos on YouTube:
And after Zwolle (one of the last shows) he said:
Looks to me there is nothing left to give away. The quality of the videos is overall very good (especially sound wise). So one can consider this to be an approval to post the videos after the tour.

As for the 'Caryl and a bunch of other' remark... Uh, wot? Really? I honestly didn't know that they are the admission committee for YouTube videos. So are you taking down the Flushing Meadows video etc? Because I'm pretty sure that 'committee' opposes any form of bootleg material...

Finally, I'm glad they are up (although a few seem to be taken down). I prefer fans being able to see them in a free way like this. Meat and his team should concentrate on the people on iOffer and equal places who actually sell bootleg material. At least having them on YT lowers the chance that fans are gonna spend money on them.

As I have been referred to ..

1 I am not part of any committee

2 Yes, I have expressed my view that I am against bootleg videos for a number of reasons:
* They are illegal, whatever anyone likes to think
* They are usually of dubious quality and don't do Meat and his performance justice. He is more than a voice.
* As Warrio said, it's against Meat's wishes. It's his performance and imo he's entitled to make the decision as to whether or not his performances are recorded and published.
* Imo he's entitled to remove any illegal recordings he wishes.

It's an issue on its last legs now anyway. Meat is no longer going to tour the big arenas, and Planet Hollywood demonstrated that it's perfectly possible to prevent illegal recording in smaller theatres.

We don't even get photos now either, which I do think is a shame. I wonder if it were not for the ease with which people can illicitly record nowadays, despite being asked repeatedly not to, even so instructed very clearly before every Last at Bat show, we might otherwise have been able to take photos .. something also illegal without the artist's intervention, but which Meat has always (with the exception of a relatively short period) allowed. Perhaps, perhaps not. We may never know.

Rather unfair. Warrio only now posts videos for which Meat has given his permission.

Maybe just the MLUKFC universe :-P

I didn't post 'em folks, just happened across them while I was browsing the site and figured some people might want to see them before they're gone.

As for videos/photos being illegal, but then Meat says photos are ok so it's fine... selective religion anyone? :lol:

Alrighty I am standing down right now. Forgive me for not knowing every little thing meat says on here. From what Ive known from the past he was against recent tour videos and still is. The channel who posted the vids has a lot of great material on it that will be lost when meat tales the videos down and the account is terminated. Anyway, the Videos are awesome.

Adje always does a great edit job.

Ive always wanted to bring that to your attention. IOffer is selling bootlegs and using our cover art!

No. Sod all to do with religion or any other thing you care to throw at my response. I thought I made that perfectly clear?

It's the law. Both photos and recordings in public venues are illegal unless permission is given. Artists may, providing the venue is OK with it, allow either or both. Some artists permit recordings. Meat allows photos, not recordings. Permission is within his gift as long as the venue agrees. What selectivity exists is entirely his choice and his right to exercise or not.

That I find bootlegs invariably poor quality so eschew them, but enjoy decent photos when Meat and the venue permits them, is my choice. Personal choice is of necessity selective, and within legal parameters entirely up to the individual.

:facepalm:

Anyway, back on topic? This was meant to be about the chance to catch some full Last at Bat shows before they disappear into the ether. For those that couldn't make the shows - there they are. Enjoy 'em, before they're gone!

How do you know bootlegs are "invariably" poor quality when you do not watch them?

Oh for heaven's sake .. I did not say I had never seen any part of one, just that I do not watch them. There have been times I have see someone on here rubbish a performance or say Meat "sang flat" etc .. I have clicked on links and a few seconds showed that the recording was utterly awful.

You are not going to get a good quality video imo holding up a phone from somewhere in a large arena with audience members sounding like cats being swung by the tail, closer to the phone than Meat. Plus no phone can ever capture the whole performance in my view. And, as I have said, Meat is more than a voice on a stage imo.

You like the things? Fine. I do not. However, whether anyone likes them or not does not alter the fact that they are not legal, and that if Meat chooses not to permit them and to have them taken own, he is absolutely within his rights to do so, and needs to give no reasons.

If you want a thread to debate the ethics of bootlegging (and subsequent watching - or not - thereof), then I'd suggest you open your own thread called 'My Opinion on Meat Loaf Bootlegs(of which I don't actually watch or like) and wait for that one to get locked down which it ultimately will. In the meantime, please don't derail this thread. It'll just turn into the usual arguments over intellectual material, copyright, and eventually hypocrisy. I'm bored of the argument. So let's just keep to the idea that this thread exists for the sake of bringing these recordings to light. By all means discuss the set list, performance, whatever. But let's not fall into the trap of bootlegs, voice, etc. It's boring.

[QUOTE=CarylB;599022]Oh for heaven's sake .. I did not say I had never seen any part of one, just that I do not watch them. QUOTE]

That is the same reason I use for porn.

Just replying to the question loaferman61 asked me directly, and which you liked :roll: Ask me a question .. I feel free to reply. I suggest if I bore you so you ignore my posts. I did yours until you quoted me.

I only posted on this thread because I was being referred to in posts made.

im not bashing Wario at all, i love his channel. I'm just saying its a little unfair to judge the person uploading these concerts when 1 or 2 of Wario's channels have been shut down due to Meat's copyright claims...We all wanna share what we love....sometimes Meat randomly decides he doesn't agree with our choice. How can we predict exactly what is the wrong video to post?

You can. He takes down videos from 1981 and from 2006 onwards.

My previous 2 channels were terminated cause of that fact the second getting terminated cause I uploaded live versions of SOM, POE, LOTO, and LA)

Fighting against youtube uploading is similar to fight against racism. It's a never endless war and totally pointless...

:shock: Thats the dumbest thing Ive ever seen posted on here.

i think the best thing for you all to do is buy a ticket for the next leg in Vegas :)

Yeah but not everyone can get to Las Vegas to be able to use it.

Plus in between ;)

My channel got terminated, a year ago, because of claims on videos from 2001 and 1996, together with a live recording from 1991. You'd think they should be safe. But in all honesty, with Meat you just never knows. If he feels he doesn't want them up he has them removed. No matter the year they are recorded. Perhaps it has to do with his mood, if he's being bored or because he genuinely doesn't like the footage. (or perhaps he just doesn't like me :-P ) Whatever the reason, I won't dispute his right to do so. But I cheer the people that keep sharing :cool:

At least many people have been able to enjoy a LAB show for free, thanks to the existence of YouTube. And especially for those who couldn't attend a live show, I am happy. I find it sad that Meat doesn't feel that way. In that perspective I envy fans of Bruce, Jon Bon and so many others. But, what you gonna do about it ;)

alot of different airlines go there :)

That's true but unless a money tree decides to grow in my garden, that's not a lot of help. ;)

I agree on all counts!

I decided to clear up my itunes library, I've only been into Bruce for a few months but the amount of boot's I have of his is outstanding.

I feel he may have just claimed your vids cause of the blog :shrug:

Not true in the way this is worded. I can only speak for American jurisdictions, in some places... venues/festivals can include in their agreement with an artist to allow media/fan photos or disallow these. Photos/recording at shows is a venue/artist issue - not law (at least in most of America). I am currently booking shows (again, in America) and am learning the process of writing up agreements with artists. Most of what is though of as "law" is actually contractual obligations. For example, one would think it was "illegal" to record a live concert. In some places, it is perfectly legal to record; however, possessing an unauthorized audio or video recording is illegal - huge Catch 22.

Here the law prohibits any photography/recording in any public without the permission of the owner(s) of the building .. indeed it is printed on the back of any ticket I have purchased. However, venues will generally give permission if the artist makes it clear he or she is agreeable to photography and/or recording . Generally Meat allows photos, but not recording. On the Last at Bat tour the large screens at either sized of every stage displayed very prominently that no recordings were permitted.

Here's the photo I took of the video screen in Sheffield...

http://i1298.photobucket.com/albums/...0.jpg~original

I can see how people might miss the notices on the back of the tickets but I'd say it was fairly hard to miss the video screens.

I remember seeing someone being spoken to several times at that concert about taking video by the security team and in Birmingham, they reminded a few of us that had cameras out that only photographs were allowed.

Oh man, not copyright again :roll:

Please, separate thread if you want to discuss the finer elements of European/American copyright laws.

As exciting and relevant as it is ...

Perhaps you should PM a mod and ask them to split this thread if it's bothering you?

No! No! don't do that. I'm finding the information on copyright laws fascinating.:-)

Not so much that, just that no-one has even commented on the performance or the songs yet! And the copyright debate is one that we've had to the nth degree already. Still, it's easy to move it forward. Thoughts on the set anyone?

I thought the set was excellent. I'd have preferred the whole of Redlight over Redlight/Lemon as I've heard Lemon oodles of times. Also I thought the first act was a bit short. And it would have been nice to have Rock And Roll Dreams and the long intro to All Revved Up. But all that is just nit-picking. The show was excellent and the second act worthy of the ticket price alone. :twisted:

All I can say is that the person who put all the videos together into the concert footage must be a brilliant guy :twisted: I bet a lot of time and effort went into that process...

Personally I thought the set list was outstanding - though I agree with Evil One on Red Light/Lemon (and also the fact that, yeah, it's nitpicking). It took a while for Meat to get warmed up, vocally, but later on he seemed to be doing pretty well (though I've got to say, not as well as some recordings I've heard from the Hang Cool Tour).

I agree. Setlist was very good. Meat sounded good and the band was great.
On another note, my opinion, if Meat doesn't like himself on youtube then he has every right to have it removed.
I don't understand why so many people jump in to claim to know what Meat wants or would want one way or the other.
He's the only one who makes those kind of decisions. Leave it to him. He's a big boy and can take care of himself.

I can see what you're getting at but I think that for every time there's going to be a discussion about YouTube videos, the discussion will occur again.

I agree that the discussion has been done so many times that any regular has a fairly good idea of the feelings of the other regulars about the subject. Some like bootlegs, others don't and then there's some who don't feel strongly either way, that won't change but I think that this is a discussion that may occur every time the subject of a bootleg recording is brought up.

I haven't watched the bootlegs in question but since they were recorded at London, which is a concert I went to, I'll base my comments on the set list as I remembered it from that.

It was a well thought out set list which I feel was designed to appeal to the majority of fans as it included a lot of the more popular songs. I thought that opening with 'Runnin' For The Red Light' was a fantastic move, particularly given the lyrics of the song. However from a personal point of view and as someone who has thoroughly enjoyed Meat's two most recent albums, I was a little bit disappointed that I didn't hear more songs from those and in particular, the songs from HIAH. I'm not a fan of 'Two Out of Three Ain't Bad' and would have preferred to have heard a song like 'All Of Me' or 'Our Love and Our Souls' but I'm not saying that I disagree with what Meat had decided to do with the setlist.

I posted reviews of the shows and my comments on set list, performance, brilliant video footage etc at the time the tour was running. Nothing more to add to my take, which was and remains that it was an amazing farewell tour, superb performances, an opening set perfectly crafted for a final tour, with RFTRL stating the objective of the evening .. and imo eclipsed only by the second act which was a sensation, going beyond my expectations every night. I thought the setlist was perfectly put together then, and with hindsight still believe that.

I could not at the time, and cannot now, fault a tour that Meat aced every step of the way, was full of passion and charged with emotion, and had each packed arena on its feet. The reviews posted here for every show back that up imo. Nothing caught on a mobile phone could capture or do justice to the electric atmosphere at each show, or the continuous wave of affection from the thousands of fans who had come to see this farewell from a man who had meant so much to them for so long.

Meat's first appearances here in the UK were on the OGWT, and were a sensation that had the BBC switchboards jammed. His final tour appearances here this year were imo a triumph, and one fitting to close a chapter in the work of an amazing performer, the like of whom we will not see again. He did himself and us proud every night.

Agreed, from a certain point of view. To play devil's advocate you could argue that with a first person recording you get more of an idea of what it was 'actually' like more than you would with an edited, multi-cam blu-ray. It's not my view, but valid all the same. I know which I'd rather watch, but when an alternative isn't available I think that a fan recording of a show is a pretty good representation of something we night not have otherwise been able to see.

I cannot find a blog by Meat. I see the Facebook and the meatloaf.net but if he has a blog, where is it? googling did not find it.

Adje knows what I was talking about. don't worry bout it. ;)

And what a fantastic blog it was :twisted:

I miss that blog, really got me into Meat Loaf.

R.I.P :(

I see the videos are gone. I was on Ray Wylie Hubbard's site and he has an interesting notice posted about bootlegs etc His attitude is hilarious- and straight to the point.
This is a c&p.

"Feel Free to Download these and enjoy. However..... if while surfing the internet entertaining my insomnia some evening I should find these very same songs put on some compilation and being sold anonymously on ebay or in some far away country just know that I WILL hunt you down and I WILL find you..... and it won't be pretty.

xxx
Mother H"

No they're not.

Just again... I really don't understand the fight against youtube and uploading. In Latin America and Asia all CDs are copied and sold on street. Even the police buy CDs there. Why? Because when you buy an MP3 player, a new iPod or a notebook, you pay royalties as tax. So?

The problem? People upload videos of very bad concerts and artists don't want to see them on internet. Solution? Do high level concerts and fans make your free marketing.

Yes that may be so but just because something is permitted in one country, it doesn't mean that it is or should be permitted in another.

I disagree with you. Sometimes it's NOT the quality of the concert at all, it's the quality of the recording. I've been to several high quality concerts but have seen YouTube uploads that are a long way off of portraying what it was actually like. If you were an artist you would want your work to be seen at it's best and how it was intended to be seen. I know I would.

I hope that image is not copyrighted.

Again I have to ask why everyone is supposing to know what Meat wants.
Wario has his channel and Meat is ok with it so that flies in the face of you have to be there to appreciate it. Meat clearly has no problem with what Wario has posted.
I enjoy watching the youtube video's and especially Wario's channel. Gives me the chance to check out anything associated with Meat.
I know that it's not the same as being there and would never compare it.
But it does give me an opportunity that I never had 30 years ago. The ability to watch a great performance.
Anything Meat doesn't want up for public consumption comes down, That is fair play.
But it truly getting boring reading the pros and cons of youtube. Guess what? It's not going away and only Meat can control it.

I often wonder why some artists hate YouTube. I have bought many albums after seeing a video on yt.

YES!!!!

couldn't agree more

it's a great shop window for performers... video killed the radio star???
with youtube, the radio star can be back (through video ironically)

I love YouTube, and not just because I make money out of it.

Oh for heavens sake, I was NOT claiming that I know what Meat Loaf wants, I was just posting a generalised question about whether ANY artist would want their work to be seen at it's best in response to someone who suggested that the problem was poor quality concerts rather than the quality of the recording. I was NOT the one who brought the matter back up.

If you enjoy YouTube then good for you.

I think he's made it pretty clear what he doesn't want. And he said at Cardiff that whilst he understood someone recording something and keeping it on their own computer as a souvenir .. he did NOT want them posted publicly. That certainly indicates to me what he wants and doesn't want.

Not now, because he operates within the boundaries Meat sets. However, Meat being OK with the recordings Warrio puts on line does not "fly in the face of you have to be there to appreciate it", which is the view of some people, me being one of them. I do not watch videos on Warrio's site because I DO find bootleg recordings fall way short of the live performance, whether Meat has permitted their being put on YT or not.

Indeed. Actually, were I to record anything I would put it on line for private viewing only and send him a link so he could check it out, and ask his permission.

I never said you did. I didn't name anyone in particular just pointing out in general.
I enjoy seeing many artists videos on the internet. I fully realize that I am missing the thrill of seeing that artist live.
But at least it's better than nothing.

The last time I went and saw Meat, the last thing I even thought about was recording it. You hit in on the head in another post. I was standing the whole concert and not believing how good it was and Meat is better every time.

Thank you :-) I was struck too, like many others during the LAB tour, and in Vegas, that Meat's performance keeps getting better, and I use the word performance intentionally. He is so much more than a voice on a stage, but so many illicit recordings simply do not capture this imo .. and whilst some understand that, some don't. Meat works so hard to make every show the best it can be, and we know he reads the comments people post and cares about what is said. That's why I understand his aversion to poor quality recordings that attract negative comments.

Your welcome
I watch them and know how much better it would be to actually be there. But that is not always possible so if I can't see him live I'll take the next best thing, kind of like reading the coles notes of a literary classic.

Well when you quoted my message it did appear like you were directing your response at me.

If we're going to go down this road, for the eleventy-millionth time, then I'd suggest that live shows and 'bootleg' recordings are two completely different mediums, and not comparable in the slightest. Nor should they be. The 'I only go to concerts therefor all unofficial recordings are bad/superfluous' argument doesn't really stand up, because A, it's not an either/or argument, and B, not all bootleg recordings are low quality.

I hate to say it, but Youtube clips are probably going to be the immediate future for the music industry. Albums don't make money anymore. Nor do live Dvds. MTV doesn't have the same output and appeal that it once did, and Top of the Pops is a thing of the past. There isn't another place that freely promotes artists like Youtube does at the moment, good and bad. And unless there's some incredible, un-copyable new format lurking around the corner, it's probably fair to say that it's going to be this way for a while. Consumer society has eaten the music industry. People are consuming music, film, television and video like it's fast food, and that trend isn't going to stop any time soon. So, for the moment, we're stuck with it!

P.S. This isn't a direct response to any one post or poster (yes, that means you, Jenna :-) )

I don't think anyone has made the argument 'I only go to concerts therefor all unofficial recordings are bad/superfluous' . I've said they are imo usually of dubious quality, and that this is the reason I understand why Meat does not give his permission for them at concerts, does not like them, and has most of them taken down. Yes, I choose to get to live shows, but that of itself does not make bootlegs bad .. poor sound and shaky camera-phone work does that for me. My argument is more the reverse .. that unofficial recordings are usually of poor quality therefore I only go to concerts. Yes, I am generally against bootlegs made and published without permission, and specifically against those of Meat's shows because he has repeatedly indicated they are against his wishes. I like and respect him so I accept his decisions .. even those that might disappoint me.

I'm sure you're right that they are the immediate future for the music industry. I think one (and I am saying one) reason that albums don't make money any more is due to the immediate, and illegal, sharing of new albums which make them available for download on YT and other internet channels. Thankfully Meat still has the desire to make new albums, even though he won't be making money from a new album through touring now. Technology has at least enabled them to be made at a lower cost.

However, as I said at the beginning, as far as bootlegs of Meat's concerts go, I see the issue as being on its last legs because he won't be touring the big arenas any more. Small theatres which suit the kind of show he wants to do now can easily prevent illegal recording, which as far as Meat's live performances are concerned will bring us back to the time when if you wanted to see an artist live you saved and bought a ticket.

(I'd add that I had no intention of going down this road for the eleventy millionth time btw. I only posted on the 8th day of this thread when my name was quoted and being referred to as heading some censorship body. I posted only because of this and to clarify my position. Others chose to question it :-) )

Hi Jenna
If that were the case it would have been a private message. It's not necessary to cause upset. I was just following the you tube videos and saw how it veered away from content to something else.

I agree with the majority of what you said, Caryl. Maybe an idea for Meat to consider would be setting up a rig - much like a lot of bands do these days - which would enable him to capture several songs a night which he could then release, at his own discretion, through Youtube, as a form of promotion for any upcoming shows? I'd imagine that most of the 'shaky camera-phone' footage, though it'll no doubt still be uploaded, would be overlooked in favour of frequent, official releases.

I believe Meat already has 'a rig' set up at many shows. This is where the footage used for promo videos and the like comes from. It's good enough quality for a 30 second commercial but probably not for a full DVD.

I was thinking more along the lines of one or two songs a month, etc. from a specific show, rather than a whole DVD.

It would be good, but I'm sure the knobs at iOffer would soon start selling them on DVD. :roll:

I hear ya.

Still, Nightwish did it earlier this year with a song or two, and the publicity's been really good for them (you have that first hand - I had no interest in seeing them until I saw the upload with their new singer).

I think after all the dealings in the past and present with lawyers and record companies, Meat probably has established direct ownership over all concerts.
Again probably why there are so few from the 80's. Maybe down the road Meat will get around to giving them his approval for a proper release.

Believe me, Caryl, if someone really wanted to record those shows, they could/would have. I've seen an audio recording come out of an industry event where security was supposedly at airport level. Just because things aren't posted online someplace doesn't mean they don't exist in trading circles.


True, but not everyone out there is using cellphones. It's not 1975 anymore- technology has gotten quite good, and some people really know what they're doing. l've seen, and especially heard, boots that rival official releases.

Yep, careers have been launched that way, including Bieber, if I'm not mistaken. (Only commenting on the power of the medium, not the content. Lol)

I seem to recall Meat saying perhaps in reference to the amazing 1993 VH-1 shows that determining the rights was difficult. I suspect that for many TV performances that may be an issue. I don't think he has direct ownership of all concerts maybe many or even most but not all.

There are all kinds of things that people will do if they really want to of course .. far worse than ignoring the explicit wishes of a venue and the artist at a show. And of course Meat's issue is with them being put on public display.

However, nothing emerged from Rocktails and Cocktails. Perhaps no-one in the audience wanted to go to the lengths of wearing special glasses .. but certainly in that small theatre Planet Hollywood had people on duty who were extremely vigilant.

They did of course have a huge notice as you went in, and everyone was told as their tickets were checked and then again as they were shown to their seats that no recording or photography was permitted, and failure to comply with this would result in their being removed from the theatre. Perhaps the audience were just more reasonable, and being told three times that it was not permitted, accepted that. It seems wholly reasonable and correct behaviour to me.

Meat said that PH were extremely firm on this and that we would see no videos on YT .. and he was right.

Fine. However, that doesn't mean that many on YT HAVE been shot with phones, and are poor quality. Nor are the good quality ones you refer to legal without the venue's/artist's agreement, nor is recording them and putting them on public view respecting the wishes of an artist who does not want this done, and has not given his or her agreement. If he or she doesn't mind, is happy with the publication and sharing of bootlegs, gives permission, fine. We then each choose to watch them or not depending on the quality and our personal choice. If they don't, for whatever reason (and they do not owe any explanation .. they have the right to make their choice) to me it's not fine.

Ultimately it comes down to this imo .. the level of respect one shows the artist one professes to follow.

Nightwish are awsome! flo yanson new lead girl fits them perfect, new live dvd out end of the month :)

Are you sure of that???