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XPattiRussoX
20 Nov 2005, 12:47
Does anybody want to help me out by giving me there take on Couldn't have said it better (Live version). I'm not very strong on analysisng the orchestral part in particular. So if anyone could add there two cents it would be appreciated

Pudding
21 Nov 2005, 20:21
I notice not many people have replied to this :shock:

Are you wanting to know peoples opinion on whether the orchestral arrangements fit with the song. And what instrument(s) works best to emphasizes a certain mood in certain part of the song?

Pud :twisted:

Tim
21 Nov 2005, 20:32
Well, got some live versions of the song, if that is what you mean. Or is the question that you want to know the chords of the orchtestra from ML live with the MEO? I think the question is a bit foggy :lol:

XPattiRussoX
22 Nov 2005, 20:49
sorry, the question is, how does the orchestra support the band. I can analyse the band, but im not very good on analysing the orchestra. Which parts of the orchestra are playing at certain points, what they are playing, how they are playing, and how it adds to the effect of the orchestra if ya get what i mean

Pudding
23 Nov 2005, 22:34
OK, here's my analysis:

For the first minute you can't hear the orchestra at all, which I think they could have been used for a more powerful intro.
When the piano solo kicks in at around 1:14 you can just hear the violins, but for me they weren't loud enough to fully compliment the piano. However the orchestration fits in very well, just not loud enough IMO
At around 1:30 when the song kicks up a gear, you can't hear the orchestra at all. Either this was intentional, which makes no sense to me or the NLE were just overpowering. But you then get to hear the orchestra again but I believe the brass section is used too much and you get funny sort of squeaks (that's what it sounds like to me)
When you do hear the strings, they really do compliment the song.
At around 2:25 you have some kind of electronic beat box bass being played, which doesn't do the song or the orchestra any favours. In fact you don't get to hear the orchestra only a faint echo of an oboe, which again I think should have been louder.
At 3:12(ish) when Patti sings "You have the right" I have no idea what the trumpet/cornet/some brass instrument is doing but it doesn't sound right. Again you get the same effect at around 3:18. Which makes is sound like elephants calling. Then with the "You Get that Smile" you get no real force from the orchestra, no kick in the pants, which is what is needed at this point.
When Meat Loaf says "Shhh" and after a brief pause the piano plays, the strings sound great because not only are they heard but they're complimenting Mark, which they didn't fully do earlier (around 1:14)
I do like the chimes or whatever they are called at 4:17 and work really well leading to Paul's solo. Because it is (more or less) a guitar solo, having the orchestra play at this point wouldn't add anything to the feel or mood, and I think it's a good move not to hear them. But when he's almost finished and they start singing whooooa-whooooaaa-whoooooooaaaa! at 4:36(ish) the strings are totally underused and the opportunity for a great crescendo seems to fall flat like a pancake.
When they sing the line "And I know you feel the same" at 5:00(ish) why something from the orchestra isn't heard I don't know, as an opportunity to really emphasize that line and to bring the mood down slightly is lost.
I also feel that "And I know you feel the same. I've wondered all my life, if this moment comes would I know what to say" sounds pretty dull. And something from the woodwind/brass section could have really added to the mood.
When they start the "You say nothing at all" bits I feel a solo oboe would work wonders with a faint backing from the strings. Instead you get the chimes again. Why? I don't know, but they do nothing for me.
When the strings are heard at around 5:31 I love'em I think they work extremely well with the song at this point. When Patti starts singing the line "Now you finish me off......etc" you hear John on the drums which is great, but perhaps some kettle drums as well at this point, might not have been so bad.
From then on the orchestra (which should have been a touch louder IMO) repeats the same bit over and over again, with very little change, until 6:50 when they do change and it's a nice one. But then they keep repeating that bit which sounds monotonous and gets a little painful to hear.
The ending was also a little painful to hear as it seemed to drag, with real ooomph! of a big finish that leaves you with a tingle down the spine.

Over all I'd say the orchestra was extremely quiet in parts, when they should have been heard. And in other parts the orchestration didn't seem to fit in with the band or the mood the song was taking. Saying that, given the amount of time they probably didn't have to prepare, they didn't do a bad job.

Well that's my analysis.

Pud :twisted: