'Paradise', a remake of... 'Dance in my pants' ?...

[Wolfling]

Hi there all, I've read some things about 'Dance in my pants' here and in official reviews of Steinman's exotic album release of 1981 that confuse me. Both responses seem to belittle the song as a failed attempt to create another 'Paradise by the dashboard light'. According to the critics 'Dance in my Pants' obviously lacked the originality of 'Paradise' and was some sort of third rate self-epigone effort to give Karla a real bite at Meat which then became a bite out of Jim when Jim replaced Meat with himself (Meat had lost his voice, Jim just had his own lost voice back :). So far so good. Its not my favourite song either, let that be clear, BUT.....

1. 'Dance in my pants' was part of Jim's Neverland musical 1974-1977, as was the bulk of the 'Bat out of Hell' album (except 'Paradise')

2. Therefore 'Dance in my pants' MAY well pre-date 'Paradise' (it surely was written simultaneously or almost simultaneously with it) and it actually COULD have been the direct source for 'Paradise', just as Neverland's 'The formation of the pack' became 'All revved up' on the album.

3. So, theoretically, 'Paradise' could have been the result of a reworking of 'Dance in my pants' instead of the other way around... COULD, I'm not saying it WAS. I just have questions looking at the actual time line, which is in part verifyable (see above) and in part not (I do not know exact recording dates for each 'Bat out of hell' track and I do not know how Jim's Neverland developed from 1974 to 1977).

3. 'Paradise' actually also appears in Neverland, at least the instrumental intro bars of it, as 'Instrumental #4', which concludes Neverland.

4. Since 'Heaven can wait' and 'Bat out of hell' also appear in Neverland, this raises a number of questions regarding the chronological conception of 'Bat out of hell' as an album which I have never seen discussed anywhere (I'm not saying you haven't. I just point to my questions, answers would be great!).

5. Unfortunately 'Dance in my pants' was placed in 'Neverland' right after the break, and it is among the 20 minutes missing from the 1977 'Neverland' recording. We don't even know who were supposedly singing it: You'd think Baal and Wendy? It could be her parents as well, they sang 'City lights' in act I. Or Tink and someone else.

6. Perhaps the most unanswered question of all (to me) is why Meat wasn't singing in the Neverland reprise in Washington April 1977? Most of his 'Bat' songs were there in one way or another, the album was already recorded and he was clearly Baal. Ellen was actually there, she was Wendy, singing a significant chunk of 'Bat out of hell', all of 'Heaven can wait' and a lot of dialogue (including many famous 'Bat out of hell' song lines). Jim's 'Death of American guitar' was there. Even Karla was there, doing back up vocals. Only Meat was left in the dark... Why?

Clearly the cliche story of 'Dance in my pants' needs adjusting. I'd like to know some of the answers and perhaps I'm not the only one in this...

Wolfling.

[rockfenris2005]

All I know about "Neverland" is that it wasn't the same lyrics. So perhaps it became more like "Paradise" later on. We just simply don't know for sure, unless someone here worked on the original production, because that part isn't on the tape. The only way to find out for certain would be to see a script for that workshop production.

Also, "Dance In My Pants" was sung by the Historian and Wendy.

[Wolfling]

All I know about "Neverland" is that it wasn't the same lyrics. So perhaps it became more like "Paradise" later on. We just simply don't know for sure, unless someone here worked on the original production, because that part isn't on the tape. The only way to find out for certain would be to see a script for that workshop production.

Also, "Dance In My Pants" was sung by the Historian and Wendy.
Thanks Rockfenrise, that makes me lament the loss of that section all the more, Wendy, which would have been another Ellen bit on tape, she's awesome in the rest and everything she did after that. Steinman's site leave's out (or seems to leave out) the unrecorded sections from the text, you wouldn't know where to find the original lyrics of 'Dance in my pants' from Neverland? I know I'm asking these things 5 years too late :( But as for the exact or near exact recording dates of 'Bat out of hell', I'd think this must somehow have been a topic here in the past 20 years or so, no?

[letsgotoofar]

The album was finished and in the can, about to search for a label to release it once Warner Bros. dropped it judging by the content of the following, by the time the workshop was up and running. It's mentioned in several program bios (https://mljs.evilnickname.org/jimsteinman/neverland/program.html) for the show, including Jim's and Ellen's.

[Wolfling]

I'll ask Ellen about the exact order of things, she might now be the last who can tell. If I get a reply, I'll let you know.

[rockfenris2005]

Thanks Rockfenrise, that makes me lament the loss of that section all the more, Wendy, which would have been another Ellen bit on tape, she's awesome in the rest and everything she did after that. Steinman's site leave's out (or seems to leave out) the unrecorded sections from the text, you wouldn't know where to find the original lyrics of 'Dance in my pants' from Neverland? I know I'm asking these things 5 years too late :( But as for the exact or near exact recording dates of 'Bat out of hell', I'd think this must somehow have been a topic here in the past 20 years or so, no?

All I can tell you is that I asked someone involved with the production once if there was a script, that still existed, so we could see those missing parts, and they said they had one but they'd have to fish it out from wherever that might be.

The other two songs were, basically, "Hushabye" from "Rhinegold" and "Hear the Screams" from "Dream Engine". Indeed, they're sung by the same actors.

[Wolfling]

All I can tell you is that I asked someone involved with the production once if there was a script, that still existed, so we could see those missing parts, and they said they had one but they'd have to fish it out from wherever that might be.


That would be helpful Rockenfris – perhaps you can remind those people/that person that they were going to look for it? I'm sure there's 5 more people interested in this, surely on this forum...

I doubt the inserts of 'Rhinegold' and 'Dream Engine' sounded even remotely like that in the 'Neverland' tape after Act I. Fantastic to have those works as such though, that's another thing. Its the 'Dance in my pants' section however that matters here. So it had different text and was for the Historian and Wendy, although no one (that I know) has ever seen that text... it would be very very interesting to see the actual words and phrases used.

Thanks for you reply by the way, Wolfling.

[rockfenris2005]

Here is some more info you might appreciate:

The first part of the second act of “Neverland” is unfortunatly not available. According to Barry Keating on Facebook: It is a huge miracle that the recording of Neverland exists on the internet. The only reason it is there is because I asked Jim to record that performance (Richard Dunne played Baal in Washington replacing Richard Gere replacing Jim — but that's another story) Jim recorded act one on the ghetto blaster we used for rehearsals but forgot to turn it on until half way through act two skipping me and Ellen Foley singing Dance In My Pants (the new Keep On Trucking) and Joanna Albrecht's amazing Hushaby (borrowed from Rhinegold.) Kingdom Come was exactly the same as Hear The Screams in Dream Engine sung in both by Larry Dilg.

Larry Dilg was stunning as Tink … I am pretty sure nothing was resolved about what at happened to Tink except that he died with the rest of the Lost Boys and Killer nuns. Only 13 year old Con Erico, Baal, the Historian and a pre-teen girl from the City survived.

I don't think we worked very hard to justify Mother River replaced by Hushaby. Joanna just blew everyone away with her singing but I don't think it made too much sense in the plot. It was a lullaby to the Lost Boys who were about to be slaughtered. The Scene that followed it was exactly the same as the Max and Emily nun scene at Amherst.

https://mljs.evilnickname.org/jimsteinman/neverland/transcript.html