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Wario
17 Aug 2013, 02:43
Instead of littering the horse race thread with thoughts and anger about Pati's termination I thought Id start a new thread.

I am wondering why this happened. Why meat decided to "terminate" her, as she says on FB.

Thats harsh. I hope she didn't do anything or something

renegadeangel
17 Aug 2013, 02:45
Sounds like its all going to come out eventually, maybe a book

AndrewG
17 Aug 2013, 02:51
Instead of littering the horse race thread with thoughts and anger about Pati's termination I thought Id start a new thread.

I am wondering why this happened. Why meat decided to "terminate" her, as she says on FB.

Thats harsh. I hope she didn't do anything or something

You hope she didn't do anything? This is Patti Russo you are talking about right? As in one of the nicest women I've met?!

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 02:51
What I know is this. Meat has recruited two great female vocalists, who deserve to be congratulated.

I will remember Patti with great affection, and welcome Stacy and Lisa.

Adje
17 Aug 2013, 02:56
Oh boy. I hope this isn't going to be 2007 all over :(

Anyway, wonder if this means she won't be on the new album. I was looking forward to Karla, Ellen and Patti performing together...

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 03:00
Oh boy. I hope this isn't going to be 2007 all over :(


Exactly. Meat's in great form, vocally and in terms of energy and fun. He has two great new vocalists. He will be putting on a great show tomorrow, and then in Vegas. That's what matters imo

AndrewG
17 Aug 2013, 03:01
Oh boy. I hope this isn't going to be 2007 all over :(

Anyway, wonder if this means she won't be on the new album. I was looking forward to Karla, Ellen and Patti performing together...

Indeed! :-(

melon
17 Aug 2013, 07:04
I have heard some of these blonde girls and they sound quite good, no Patti, but everyone is unique. I think these 2 are good.

I will miss Patti, but good luck to the 2 new girls.

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

stretch37
17 Aug 2013, 07:08
I think we have a spiral thread on our hands. Some of us will want to know, others will be pained having to look at it every day or threatened by the discussion.

At the end of the day, things phrased politely are not always polite. And things phrased rudely are sometimes far less offensive than something politely written that carefully implies rude things.

...Mod time...for which I am thankful ;)

cujo
17 Aug 2013, 07:15
I am gutted that Patti has gone. She has been with Meat for most of the time I have been attending shows, but for the short period she was not there I felt there was a spark missing , despite Aspen being a brilliant performer. For me the shows will not be the same.
We will probably never know why and speculating will not achieve anything, but what I will say is Patti is a lovely person.
I take it Patti is now the old pair of shoes that has to be replaced......

Wario
17 Aug 2013, 07:24
Thinking MEta just wanted a change of pace and a feel for 1987

stretch37
17 Aug 2013, 07:37
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4xQVZ1oZFo

...He said he would never let it happen again. So if its true that this is '07 all over again, I'll be pretty gutted. Seeing the band just won't be the same if that's the case....But I'm gonna wait until we hear from Meat because I know he has a big heart, and I know what he said in this interview about Patti was genuine. So as far as what Patti said on her fb, which could have multiple meanings, I'm giving Meat the benefit of the doubt on this one.

JennaG
17 Aug 2013, 08:17
I can fully understand why people are wondering and asking about this but we do not know the full circumstances that led to this and we may never know. Meat is not obliged to provide us with an explanation if he doesn't feel it is appropriate and I wouldn't expect him to provide one if he does not feel that it is appropriate.

Tina.K.
17 Aug 2013, 08:26
My first reaction: WHAT THE F***K ??!!!!

My second reaction: whatever the issue is I hope they can work it out because I think Meat = Patti and Patti = Meat. They belong together and can't do it without each other, well they actually can, but it can never be the same. Patti is Meat's rock.

I'm actually quite upset about this. :bleh:

Tina.K.
17 Aug 2013, 08:28
And a star to much in my shouting word :-)

Lee B
17 Aug 2013, 08:55
I'm actually absolutely gutted about this. I love Patti almost as much as I love Meat. Regardless of what has gone on, Meat has now lost an outstanding female vocalist.

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 09:01
I can fully understand why people are wondering and asking about this but we do not know the full circumstances that led to this and we may never know. Meat is not obliged to provide us with an explanation if he doesn't feel it is appropriate and I wouldn't expect him to provide one if he does not feel that it is appropriate.

That was my point :)

Cherry.Loaf
17 Aug 2013, 09:28
I would like to hear the other side of this. I will miss Patti tonight though :(

tonyloaf
17 Aug 2013, 09:38
I have heard some of these blonde girls and they sound quite good, no Patti, but everyone is unique. I think these 2 are good.

I will miss Patti, but good luck to the 2 new girls.

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

Well said

chawthornebales
17 Aug 2013, 09:53
I will miss patti

melon
17 Aug 2013, 10:03
I can fully understand why people are wondering and asking about this but we do not know the full circumstances that led to this and we may never know. Meat is not obliged to provide us with an explanation if he doesn't feel it is appropriate and I wouldn't expect him to provide one if he does not feel that it is appropriate.

Just because we don't know the facts doesn't mean we can't wonder why such a mainstay of the band is suddenly no longer there ;-)

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

mtaylor315
17 Aug 2013, 10:31
Could someone PM me or something with what she actually said on FB? I don't have Patti on Facebook. I presume it came from her personal page.

Very sad to hear this, I love Patti x

JennaG
17 Aug 2013, 10:35
Just because we don't know the facts doesn't mean we can't wonder why such a mainstay of the band is suddenly no longer there ;-)

I never suggested you shouldn't, just that people should bear in mind that we don't know the facts before pointing the finger of blame.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

cujo
17 Aug 2013, 10:44
I also don't understand why no mention of this in advance. Today it seems more posts are about Patti's unexpected departure than what was by all accounts a great show.

Meat Loaf_fan
17 Aug 2013, 12:03
I will miss Patti, but ... I felt that there will be changes in the band. Why? Meat said that he will not be touring (= many concerts during tour) any more. What's more - he will have shows in Vegas (this year and perhaps next). This are two reasons to expect changes in the band.

Anyway ... I feel very :( .



PS. I Wonder if people had the same thoughts in the past when Amy and Elaine Goff left the band?

renegadeangel
17 Aug 2013, 13:05
Could someone PM me or something with what she actually said on FB? I don't have Patti on Facebook. I presume it came from her personal page.

Very sad to hear this, I love Patti x



Now everyone knows. In the end it is Meat's decision and guess what. people have left the band over the years and that's how it is,
Remember, this is Meat's band and not a group. He can do whatever he feels necessary as he is the boss.
Very pointless to go on about the reasons why. Not our business. And now the show must go on.

Meat Loaf_fan
17 Aug 2013, 13:28
... And now the show must go on.

Yes, indeed ... but as I said - I feel :( ...



PS. I think that Meat will try do his best even in the present situation.

Evil One
17 Aug 2013, 13:57
There has to be more going on that currently we are unaware. You don't just sack your best ever female vocalist for no reason. Perhaps Patti was making unreasonable demands? Perhaps she had issues with Meat's management? Perhaps Meat is just being a ~~~~~~~? Until more facts are revealed I'll keep an open mind.

I do hope there is not a witch hunt against the new ladies though like there was against Aspen. It's not their fault that they are not Patti. I've seen some videos of yesterday's show and they weren't bad. One of them was clearly shitting herself but then it's their first show so that's to be expected.

And for the record I don't think Aspen was that bad either. It wasn't her fault Patti left. It wasn't her fault Meat was old, ill, pissed off and uninterested.

Variety is not a bad thing.

Anyway, who are these new ladies? Where have they come from? Do they have names? :twisted:

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 14:16
There has to be more going on that currently we are unaware .....

I do hope there is not a witch hunt against the new ladies though like there was against Aspen. It's not their fault that they are not Patti ..

And for the record I don't think Aspen was that bad either. It wasn't her fault Patti left...



Agree with all of this .. and keeping an open mind !

Butcher King
17 Aug 2013, 15:57
Now everyone knows. In the end it is Meat's decision and guess what. people have left the band over the years and that's how it is,
Remember, this is Meat's band and not a group. He can do whatever he feels necessary as he is the boss.
Very pointless to go on about the reasons why. Not our business. And now the show must go on.[/QUOTE]


WOW! I will miss Patti.

Butcher King
17 Aug 2013, 16:00
There has to be more going on that currently we are unaware. You don't just sack your best ever female vocalist for no reason. Perhaps Patti was making unreasonable demands? Perhaps she had issues with Meat's management? Perhaps Meat is just being a ~~~~~~~? Until more facts are revealed I'll keep an open mind.

I do hope there is not a witch hunt against the new ladies though like there was against Aspen. It's not their fault that they are not Patti. I've seen some videos of yesterday's show and they weren't bad. One of them was clearly shitting herself but then it's their first show so that's to be expected.

And for the record I don't think Aspen was that bad either. It wasn't her fault Patti left. It wasn't her fault Meat was old, ill, pissed off and uninterested.

Variety is not a bad thing.

Anyway, who are these new ladies? Where have they come from? Do they have names? :twisted:




I absolutely believe in mixing things up but I wasn't a fan of Aspen. Can't wait to see what Vegas will bring! :D

Dave
17 Aug 2013, 16:43
When I go to a Meat Loaf show, I personally spend just as much time watching the others on stage as I do Meat Loaf himself. The entire package of what is being presented on stage is of paramount importance. I remember watching the life of the show being sucked up by Renee Cologne. I did not physically attend shows, but from what I saw on television and product that was officially released, I did not enjoy what Aspen Miller brought to the table. That said, IMHO there has never been a more perfect foil who brought unique dynamic tension and professionalism to the stage with Meat Loaf than the stellar talents of Ms. Patti Russo. I will fully admit to going to see Meat Loaf to see Patti on stage just as much as seeing the big guy himself. This does not make me any more or less of a fan of his work than someone who attends shows just to watch Meat Loaf and nothing else - it doesn't.

Thank you to Patti Russo for all of the years. I will miss your beautiful presence on stage with Meat Loaf, but I know there are other opportunities around the corner for you. One Door Opens.... You will be missed lovely lady, you will be missed.

wolfy35
17 Aug 2013, 17:10
I am shocked because for me Patti is without a shadow of a doubt the best female vocal that has ever worked with Meat, she is the only one that has been a match for Meat vocally and in stage presence. I really can not understand why Meat would ever consider not having the person he once termed as his rock on stage with him.

Monstro
17 Aug 2013, 17:55
Please leave facebook status's etc in facebook.

MarkS
17 Aug 2013, 18:18
So many aspects of this situation will probably never be known. All that we as fans can really do is wish all involved the best in their endeavors and look forward to what the future holds.

Best of luck to Patti, you will be missed.

Roll on Vegas

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 18:29
So many aspects of this situation will probably never be known. All that we as fans can really do is wish all involved the best in their endeavors and look forward to what the future holds.

Best of luck to Patti, you will be missed.

Roll on Vegas

I agree with all of that Mark :)

Breeze
17 Aug 2013, 18:31
I feel sad that Patti is leaving. She and Meat look so beautiful together doing all the duets . I thought they were amazing together.
Of course it is Meat's decision but I buy the albums etc and can say I'm said if I am.

from HCTB, "..... there would be no me without you ...."

could someone put a link to patti's facebook ? all I can find is the wiki page.

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 18:50
Search on Facebook :)

Evil One
17 Aug 2013, 19:00
Am I alone in thinking 'Patti's Termination' isn't the best title for this thread? On the plus side Wario correctly used an apostrophe. :lol:

duke knooby
17 Aug 2013, 19:14
Am I alone in thinking 'Patti's Termination' isn't the best title for this thread? On the plus side Wario correctly used an apostrophe. :lol:

nope!!

Tina.K.
17 Aug 2013, 19:27
Every story has two sides and no one can judge or have an opinion without knowing both sides. So I won't judge or give an opinion, it just wouldn't be fair, it wouldn't be right.

The only thing I think is strange is the way of communication about this (or should I say the lack of communication). It wasn't mentioned at all and it just came out of blue, but maybe there's even a reason for that.

Anyway, I've been thinking about it whole day now...
I love Patti, she's the best singer Meat's ever had and she's a very nice lady too.
I've only bought the live albums if Patti's on it and no other female singers instead of her (except of course before she entered TNE) She's that important to me being a Meat fan.

nikox1
17 Aug 2013, 19:49
Well after looking at what patti posted on Facebook, I can see why people want to talk about it. It's a shock and she has been a huge part of the neverland express for years and years. Now of course people should show respect when they post something etc etc,, it's obviously a raw talking point at the moment. But I think people can express their views 100%,, and I am shocked at the news, it's come as a surprise to say the least. Now I don't know the full story just like the rest if you on here, but I'm a fan of meats music and from what I have seen and heard from him over the years hd comes across as a nice person etc etc,, patti the same. But she posted what she did on her very own Facebook, so to me and anybody else who seen it? - she was fired I think? Sad but true,, my world will not end and life goes on for sure, but I will say this = me being a fan of a musician , is exactly that. I'm a fan if he's music, I'm a fan of some if he's movies etc etc,, I don't know him personally, infact I don't think anybody does on here? If he makes decisions outside of he's music or acting I don't really care, he has he's private life and as do I, so I don't care what he does outside of music and acting, of course I wish him good health etc etc,, but I do agree with some people's posts, some of the arse kissing and Staunt defending of meat is not needed ( not on this subject anyway ). People are just surprised by the news and want to air their views

Sue K
17 Aug 2013, 19:59
Imo ... Meat doesn't owe any explanation ... Patti was the one who put personal business out on social media... so... imo ... it's on her to explain ... :shrug: ... said with all respect ... I've always liked the persona of Patti she allows the world to see... and enjoyed immensely her interaction with Meat on stage ...

nikox1
17 Aug 2013, 20:03
Imo ... Meat doesn't owe any explanation ... Patti was the one who put personal business out on social media... so... imo ... it's on her to explain ... :shrug: ... said with all respect ... I've always liked the persona of Patti she allows the world to see... and enjoyed immensely her interaction with Meat on stage ...

I agree, If meat does not want to explain? I don't mind, patti put it up true. Then again she maybe feels she has every right? Etc etc,,,, now all I'm waiting for is the new music

Sue K
17 Aug 2013, 20:08
now all I'm waiting for is the new music

I'm all for that !!! ... :up: ...

AndrewG
17 Aug 2013, 20:27
Imo ... Meat doesn't owe any explanation ... Patti was the one who put personal business out on social media... so... imo ... it's on her to explain

That makes no sense.

You are saying if someone gets fired from a job then it is always up to that person to explain? That's just crazy. :nuts:

Personal business? She is not performing on stage, for everyone to see. It's hardly personal to inform us why she is not there. She could be dead, sick on holiday or indeed fired from the band. This is exactly what she told us.

Breeze
17 Aug 2013, 22:22
ML certainly does not have to explain to us why he terminated Patti, but I would think he would . After all, we are his loyal fans. I would think he would offer something to us.

wolfy35
17 Aug 2013, 22:26
I agree, If meat does not want to explain? I don't mind, patti put it up true. Then again she maybe feels she has every right? Etc etc,,,, now all I'm waiting for is the new music

Maybe the reason Patti posted it the way she did & when she did was as a pre emptive strike to stop her facebook page being flooded by people asking her why she was not on stage with Meat.

If her or Meat want to say why it happened they will when the time is right.

Yevonda
17 Aug 2013, 22:50
I am not sure why Patti is no longer with the band. I do not think it is my place to even give a suggestion as to why Meat and Patti parted ways.

The only opinion I feel I can give is that I do not believe this decision was made lightly, or hastily, for that matter. It does not make sense on a business level that (whomever makes the decision to hire and fire band members) would fire someone who is such an integral part of the team on a whim. I am sure many hours went into this decision.


With that being said, I respect Patti and Meat's privacy.
If either of them feel the need to say anything publically they will.

I welcome the newest editions to the band and I am excited to hear them sing in Vegas. I am sure this can't be easy for either of the women. To come into a new band and only have a couple of days rehearsal time before doing their first shows and then go into a 6 week stay in Vegas. They have big shoes to fill and I think we owe it to both women to show nothing but support, respect and excitement!

Vickip
17 Aug 2013, 22:58
I am not sure why Patti is no longer with the band. I do not think it is my place to even give a suggestion as to why Meat and Patti parted ways.

The only opinion I feel I can give is that I do not believe this decision was made lightly, or hastily, for that matter. It does not make sense on a business level that (whomever makes the decision to hire and fire band members) would fire someone who is such an integral part of the team on a whim. I am sure many hours went into this decision.


With that being said, I respect Patti and Meat's privacy.
If either of them feel the need to say anything publically they will.

I welcome the newest editions to the band and I am excited to hear them sing in Vegas. I am sure this can't be easy for either of the women. To come into a new band and only have a couple of days rehearsal time before doing their first shows and then go into a 6 week stay in Vegas. They have big shoes to fill and I think we owe it to both women to show nothing but support, respect and excitement!

:up:

Breeze
17 Aug 2013, 23:31
Can't disagree with above comments in general, but still feel that he'd say something about this to his most loyal fans. Patti is not just anyone, she is Patti Russo, the other half of most of his best duets.

Monstro
17 Aug 2013, 23:40
but still feel that he'd say something about this to his most loyal fans.

To say nothing of the people who paid bloody good money for tickets expecting what they thought was the NLE as they knew it.

CarylB
17 Aug 2013, 23:42
I don't know whether the email was to inform or confirm .. and I'm not at all sure anyone here does. This is what I'm getting at. Inform would suggest it comes out of the blue .. confirm would suggest it came after discussion. Does anyone know which was the case? I don't. I have no idea what communication there was between Meat and Patti, but like Yevonda I think there will be a lot we know nothing about. "Termination" suggests to me more the ending of a contract, something that wouldn't be done on a whim, and usually not without often protracted discussion/negotiation

I do understand people are upset. Even angry and hurt that Patti has gone from the NLE; I understand that too. It's just not imo best to guess when you're short on information.

Can't disagree with above comments in general, but still feel that he'd say something about this to his most loyal fans. Patti is not just anyone, she is Patti Russo, the other half of most of his best duets.

But again, as we don't know who was involved in what, when, or how it ran etc we don't know what Meat would be in a position to say, even if he wanted to discuss such things with his fanbase. The forum is open to anyone who applies to join. Journalists for eg could join and read anything here once registered, not just his most loyal fans. There is a bigger picture.

melon
18 Aug 2013, 00:27
That makes no sense.

You are saying if someone gets fired from a job then it is always up to that person to explain? That's just crazy. :nuts:

Personal business? She is not performing on stage, for everyone to see. It's hardly personal to inform us why she is not there. She could be dead, sick on holiday or indeed fired from the band. This is exactly what she told us.


This is a bit out of line. That is not what Sue meant.

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

Sue K
18 Aug 2013, 01:26
This is a bit out of line. That is not what Sue meant.

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

Thanks, Melz ...

White of High
18 Aug 2013, 01:42
xKLLaaLgJ-k

Breeze
18 Aug 2013, 02:08
Thanks White for putting up that video.
I guess all that is left is the postmortem and some crying.
Breaking up is hard to do.

Nick
18 Aug 2013, 02:57
I'd love to know the url of Patti's Facebook! Call me technologically impaired, but I can't find it!

If it's against the rules I'll keep looking!

The Flying Mouse
18 Aug 2013, 03:06
:twisted: Jesus Tapdancin Christ :shock:
This is a hell of a shock, to say the least, and also extremely sad news :sad:

I think it's perfectly natural for fans to want to talk about this, but at the same time can we keep speculation to a minimum please?
It does little to help when emotions are running high.

Can I also ask that we all post in a mutually respectful manner.
There are several issues being raised on this thread. Patti's termination, weather this thread should even exist, and should we, as fans, feel entitled to any explanation from Meat or Patti as to what has happened.
Obviously people are going to have very different views on each of these subjects, but please post your opinion (and respond to the opinions of others) without resorting to any demeaning comments.

We don't know the reasons and circumstances behind Patti's departure, at what level it was suggested and decided, when it decided, and how much Patti was made aware of what was going on through prior correspondence.
That said, I would personally find it incredible if Meat himself would not be involved in decisions governing his own band :wtf:

Until such time any explanation is offered answering some of the above questions, i'm not about to vilify Meat or condemn Patti.

To Patti - I (and 1000's like me) love you very much.
You've been a big part of our journey for the last 20 years, and it's very, very sad to see your time with the band come to a close :sad:
Your onstage performance is overshadowed only by your gracious offstage manner when meeting fans.
Don't worry too much though. You're quite a talented lass :wink: , and i'm sure you won't be out of work for too long.
Our loss is some other lucky b@stards gain.

It's a sad day to be a Meat fan :sad:

To Meat - (without sarcasm or irony) I'm sorry to see you lose one of the biggest assets you have.
I'm sure you know yourself how valued Patti is in the hearts of your fans, and how much she brings to the table with her performance.
It can't be easy to see her gone.


To the new blood - Welcome to the party, ladies :up:
Patti is a pretty hard act to follow, and I wish you both the best of luck in making the roles your own.
You'll be overanalysed, criticized, and Wario will make wild and improbable statements about what you'll be performing, but we only do it because we care :mrgreen:

Breeze
18 Aug 2013, 03:07
nick,
i have the same issue, TC. It is under Patrica Russio .
The pic is one with her looking downward wearing yellow.

Breeze
18 Aug 2013, 04:27
Nick, I hope you found her page, she is not wearing yellow but dark brown. there is a bit of a yellow cast to her picture.
It is bad luck to be the last poster on a thread, someone post after me, please. :|

The Flying Mouse
18 Aug 2013, 04:33
It is bad luck to be the last poster on a thread, someone post after me, please. :|

:twisted: OK :mrgreen:

Nick, I hope you found her page, she is not wearing yellow but dark brown. there is a bit of a yellow cast to her picture.


I think she's taken the post down.
I think it was a good move on her part to do so :up:
You can either tell your side of the story, or say nothing.
Posting one fact without any additional background info can lead to a lot of speculation :bleh:

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 08:47
I think she's taken the post down.

Yes she did, yesterday, saying it was time to put things to rest


I think it was a good move on her part to do so :up:
You can either tell your side of the story, or say nothing.
Posting one fact without any additional background info can lead to a lot of speculation :bleh:


Agreed on all counts

Tomjoad
18 Aug 2013, 12:55
In the last few weeks, when Patti was already out (she received the mail in late july) Meat posted several times on FB showing pictures of the band reheasing, announcing repeatedly the UK dates and the Vegas shows.
But no word about changes in the band. He probably knew fans would have a bad reaction to the news Patti was out. Patti herself posted in the same hours Meat was onstage again, as if she waited until the very last moment for a public announcement that never came.
I'm not saying people have the right to know the name of every person who will take the stage, as Meat Loaf is not a group but a solo artist with a band. But I do think that an announcement by Meat introducing the new singers, and saying (at least) "Thank you Patti", was the proper thing to do.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 13:07
Patti herself posted in the same hours Meat was onstage again, as if she waited until the very last moment for a public announcement that never came.

And that's a guess. No-one knows why she timed it as she did.

But I do think that an announcement by Meat introducing the new singers, and saying (at least) "Thank you Patti", was the proper thing to do.

And whilst I defend your right to hold and express that opinion, I also defend Meat's right to make his own decision based on everything he knows, which is a lot more than any of us :-) We are fans who follow a performer and these who appear with him. He operates in a bigger business world about which we know a very limited amount.

Tomjoad
18 Aug 2013, 13:15
And whilst I defend your right to hold and express that opinion, I also defend Meat's right to make his own decision based on everything he knows, which is a lot more than any of us :-)

Nobody here wants to tell Meat what to do.
Just saying that an announcement about what he had decided would have been welcomed by the fans. At least, by this fan.

Wario
18 Aug 2013, 13:34
Nobody here wants to tell Meat what to do.
Just saying that an announcement about what he had decided would have been welcomed by the fans. At least, by this fan.

an announcement wouldve ruined the atmosphere of the show.

prolly why patti waited till the night of.

GDW
18 Aug 2013, 13:36
In The Land Of The Pig The Butcher is King:!:

Adje
18 Aug 2013, 13:39
Not best Rock n Roll band in the World but pure amateurism at best.

You fire your female singer (for 20 years) 3 weeks before you play 2 shows in the UK.

You get two singers that, in those 3 weeks, only get one rehearsel(???) And therefore they didn't perform very well (and I don't blame them the least bit for it). Basically you deny those girls a fair entry to a dissapointed part of your fanbase as well.

You refuse to make an anouncement, despite the knowledge you have about the love, the majority of your fanbase has for the female singer. While having 3 weeks the time to come up with a decent goodbye message.

WOW...

Tomjoad
18 Aug 2013, 13:44
an announcement wouldve ruined the atmosphere of the show.


Easy to agree, no artist whatsoever would have made that kind of announcement before or during a show.
There's the official website and there's the facebook page, and there was plenty of time to do it. Obviously, the choice was not to do it.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 14:08
You get two singers that, in those 3 weeks, only get one rehearsel(???) And therefore they didn't perform very well (and I don't blame them the least bit for it). Basically you deny those girls a fair entry to a dissapointed part of your fanbase as well.

You were at the shows? I was at Newmarket. They performed extremely well. They got a BIG round of applause .. no weak or disappointed sympathy vote. And frankly most of those around me in the crowd simply accepted them as part of the show. As to rehearsal time, surely that was down to the lead time to find and recruit and then, most significantly, to have the band all together for live rehearsal.

Anyone can post here that based on a YT video they thought the singers were .. what was one phrase? "Shitting herself"? I was there. Yes, I could see a little nervousness on occasions .. first time in a household name band before 10K people .. for sure, I'd expect that even if they'd had aa month in rehearsal. Denied a fair entry and not perform very well? In my view, as someone standing in the front with my friends, that is simply not the case .. and my friends agree with me. These singers are professionals, very talented, and contributed fully too a great show.

In the 27K odd numbers of people who saw those two shows, how do you know that a significant number of them were disappointed .. or even taken aback?

I know that there are many, many regular fans who know and love Patti, and who will have been disappointed. But I truly do not believe that they were the majority of the vast numbers there. Many there were seeing Meat for the first time ever, or the first time in many, many years. They simply got a Meat Loaf show that they thrilled to.

This is what happens when people closer to the personalties involved than the bulk of the audiences being played to are disappointed, hurt to see a singer they love is not there (both understandable), but then make judgements based on very limited knowledge of everything that has led up to a situation.

I do not know all the facts. Imo neither does anyone else here. I will miss Patti. I will miss the tours. I saw a fantastic show at Newmarket, surrounded by thousands of people who were singing along, cheering, applauding, buzzing with excitement and fun, and having a wonderful evening. That I witnessed. And if anyone was there and says the crowd were disappointed and not thoroughly enjoying themselves .. well, I'm sorry but they are deluded or prevaricating.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 14:09
Easy to agree, no artist whatsoever would have made that kind of announcement before or during a show.
There's the official website and there's the facebook page, and there was plenty of time to do it. Obviously, the choice was not to do it.

And I do not know all the facts and issues that needed to be considered when making that choice. I doubt anyone else here does either.

Tomjoad
18 Aug 2013, 14:21
And I do not know all the facts and issues that needed to be considered when making that choice. I doubt anyone else here does either.

The only thing that needed to be considered was the respect owed to the people involved and to the fans.
Even if Patti asked a million dollar a show and was put aside for this, she deserved a public thank you. No rocket science here, just politeness.

Sue K
18 Aug 2013, 14:24
Curious... and curiouser... I wonder... what would have happened ... say ... Patti was there... and Meat wasn't but filled in by one of his ... tribute singers... :twisted: ...

Evil One
18 Aug 2013, 14:26
I suspect the comments section on Youtube would be considerably different for a start. :lol:

LucyK!
18 Aug 2013, 14:33
I have a million and one thoughts on this, most of which I'm not prepared to post. The only thing I will say is that I think the situation could have been handled better.

Of course we were all going to find out eventually that Patti's gone, but personally I think people finding out when the band came on stage was the wrong way to do it. It didn't need to be a big announcement or anything major, just a quick line on here or on Facebook along the lines of "Patti will no longer be touring with Meat Loaf, we wish her well for the future. Now let us introduce Stacey and Lisa..." would have been enough. That way everyone could have had their inevitable discussions and debates, but Newmarket would have been a brand new day and we could have been ready to welcome the new girls.

As it went no-one knew, so Stacey and Lisa, who were not only under-rehearsed but understandably very nervous came on stage to a "welcome" of turning heads and mouths hitting the floor as the realisation hit that Patti was gone.

I'm not saying Meat owes an explanation for the reasoning behind Patti's departure, but knowing that she'd gone before Newmarket would have been nice.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 14:47
I suspect the comments section on Youtube would be considerably different for a start. :lol:

If you want to read the deranged ravings of a particular tribute act, yes. Otherwise you're really whistling in the wind.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 14:53
I
As it went no-one knew, so Stacey and Lisa, who were not only under-rehearsed but understandably very nervous came on stage to a "welcome" of turning heads and mouths hitting the floor as the realisation hit that Patti was gone.

Though I suspect not universally. Many of those behind me hadn't ever seen Meat, or not for years, and were not shocked at all.

I'm not saying Meat owes an explanation for the reasoning behind Patti's departure, but knowing that she'd gone before Newmarket would have been nice.

That I understand, I really do. I just remember that there may be more complicated issues around the situation for Meat, which may have swayed a decision. We just don't know. I have been in the position where the nice thing, the polite thing, would have been to say something or make some announcement, but I was unable to for a specific reason. It happens.

Adje
18 Aug 2013, 15:24
*Patti said she was terminated by email at the end of July (which is roughly 2,5 to 3,5 weeks before the shows in the UK = an average of 3 weeks) *FACT


* Meat stated here that the girls had one rehearsal. *FACT

- And despite the fact if you think they did or did not perform well (I give you that this is a personal opinion that I share with many people I have contact with - most of them attending one or both shows btw), Meat must have rememberd how Aspen got received. Or more so, how the response was on missing Patti on the band. And with this knowledge you don't throw them before the lions with one practice round. If you are a pro and if you care for them, the performance and the audience you take longer practice time. If you are a professional that cares for your performance you make sure you get more than 1 rehearsal in 3 weeks. It can be done, if you really want it to. Instead of working on the Vegas shows, work with them on these two shows as it's their first introduction to the crowd...

*No announcement was made *FACT

- And, even if it's his right to not do so, thus reactions like this (again, remember the first time they departed in 2007) were to be expected. Meat knew the emotions of those fans and yet decided to ignore them. It's a choise he made. But don't come 'boo-hooing' on here as if it's no big deal. It was a big deal then, so it's no surprise it still is a big deal.

lorenzoduke
18 Aug 2013, 15:29
Whatever Meat's issue with Patti is doesn't erase the contribution she has made to this band for two decades. Its interesting that he saw her return to the band as so important to the fans that it was worthy of announcing on national TV, yet her dismissal at a time when many were making plans for Vegas, wasn't worthy of so much as a Facebook update. I don't regard Patti as some interchangeable sidewoman, and any future shows will be depleted by her absence.

What a sour note for things to be ending on..

LisaT
18 Aug 2013, 16:10
My thoughts on the subject: From what we all know (which, of course, isn't everything), Meat seems to be a very nice person (most of the time!) and Patti seems to be a very nice person; I'm pretty sure (not 100%, because that isn't possible!) that there will be a logical explanation for this.

LisaT
18 Aug 2013, 16:14
My thoughts on the subject: From what we all know (which, of course, isn't everything), Meat seems to be a very nice person (most of the time!) and Patti seems to be a very nice person; I'm pretty sure (not 100%, because that isn't possible!) that there will be a logical explanation for this.

Ps. I've 'liked' and 'unliked' quite a few posts about this - that was when I was in an 'emotional' state! My above comment is made from my (now) logical state! ;)

Meat Loaf_fan
18 Aug 2013, 16:27
... there will be a logical explanation for this.

I don't know if there will be explanation :shrug: ...
So I have hypothesis: maybe there were quarrel about fewer concerts in the nearest future (= less money; or = less publicity)? :shrug: Or maybe there were quarrel about new type of shows (Vegas)? :shrug:


PS. This two hypothesis are only hypothesis. ;)

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 16:32
* The email Patti referred to. Would not the termination of any contract need some final confirmation, whether by snail mail, telex, fax or email? I have not seen the email, so do not know who sent it, nor what precisely it contained. It may have been a final confirmation of an agreement for all I know, or come at the end of a series of discussions. Perhaps you have seen it? To me it's a fact that needs a lot more surrounding it before I make a judgement

* Meat stated here that the girls had one rehearsal. Whether there was any possibility for longer rehearsal time I could not judge without more of the facts. I suggested some of the issues. My own view is that recruiting the right singers would be the priority, and the right singers could deliver to standard with limited rehearsal. The two chosen proved this to be the case imo. It is also my opinion that Meat and Stacy and Lisa ARE all pros. They carried it off successfully. How caNn we know whether in the timeframe there could have been more rehearsal time? I do not know enough facts about the commitments of everyone concerned etc Do you?

*No announcement was made. Not disputed. I merely said I do not know enough about the entire situation to deliver a judgement that one could or should have been made. I am sure Meat expected the kinds of posts that would be made. His world is a bit bigger and more complex than this forum. I do not know what else he had to weigh. Do you?

I take exception Adje to your comment "But don't come 'boo-hooing' on here as if it's no big deal." I have stayed calm, clear and remember that we have very limited knowledge of what has happened. Why that should be dismissed as "boo=hooing" defeats me. I have repeatedly said I understand people's disappointment, and that they feel hurt. As to whether that excuses anger, blame and condemnation of Meat, .. we clearly have different views.


Given the response from the thousands in the audiences at the racecourses (I was at one. I have spoken to others who were at Newbury) I do not think it was as big a deal to large numbers, arguably most, of them. They came to see a Meat Loaf show .. they got a damn fine one.

I don't think we can reach any mutual understanding or agreement.

Yevonda
18 Aug 2013, 16:47
With the idea that this is a Meat Loaf fan club I have a few questions.

1. Why are you making the assumption that Meat made this decision? This is business and there are many players and persons of interest in business decisions.

2. Why are you assuming that Meat sent the email? In the post Patti made (and now subsequently taken down) never referred to who sent the email.

3. Why are you assuming that Patti was hit with the news out of the blue and this was not something that had been discussed for some time?

4. Why are you acting as if this wasn't a difficult decision that needed to be made?

Meat and Patti worked together for 20+ years. Don't you think this decision hurt both Meat and Patti on a personal and professional level. Now what does Meat have to see when he comes onto a website that is suppose to show support for him, a load of negative comments. Instead of everyone being negative why don't we all stop attacking Meat and stop attacking fellow fans on this forum and just wait to see what happens. If a public announcement needs to be made it will be. Until then I don't understand why we can't take everyone's feelings and privacy into consideration.

LucyK!
18 Aug 2013, 17:00
With the idea that this is a Meat Loaf fan club I have a few questions.


A debate that's been had a thousand times before and I'm sure will be done a thousand times again.

Speaking generally, yes this is a Meat Loaf fan club but that doesn't mean that its members will like and agree with everything that Meat does. I'd imagine that applies to every fanclub in the world because we're all human with different feelings and opinions about things.

With regards to the Patti issue specifically, I agree with the points you raise, we actually know very little and now that the new band is in action we're not likely to find out (certainly not any time soon, anyway).


At the end of the day this whole thing has happened, it's not changing and we, as fans, have two choices - we can accept what's happened (whether we agree with it or not) and stick around, or don't accept what's happened and leave.

eddy<meat-loaf>rocky
18 Aug 2013, 17:07
i think as fans we should accept what has happened and move on if you want to continue supporting meat loaf then that's up to you as an individual to make your mind up but as a reasons why it has happened is no of our business but when i first heard the news i was upset but felt i couldn't be angry at meatloaf as i love his music so much and now it has sunk in i wish patti all the best in what she dose next and also i wish meat loaf all the best and i will continue to support meat and the band and also patti too

lorenzoduke
18 Aug 2013, 17:22
1. I guess people like to credit Meat as having some say over who is in his own band and that if he had wanted to keep her around he would have acknowledged both his and our disappointment at being unable to do so.

2. I don't think anyone is assuming that - rather that the email will have been sent by someone acting on his behalf.

3. Because she said she was informed 3 weeks ago and has no history of lying to fans.

4. Who is acting like that? Difficult decision or not, deciding not to tell your paying audience that a key element of your show is gone and then replacing her with people who have only had one rehearsal seems to me to imply that we should treat the change as trivial. Many of us feel strongly otherwise and being told directly or indirectly that we shouldn't care or react isn't going to change that.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 17:58
At the end of the day this whole thing has happened, it's not changing and we, as fans, have two choices - we can accept what's happened (whether we agree with it or not) and stick around, or don't accept what's happened and leave.

Yes. I saw a fan asking today .. had Meat and Patti not met would people like Meat loaf any less than they do now? Like her, my answer is no .. this will not make me enjoy his music, his shows, his acting, anything any less. Could he have handled recent events any differently? I do not know anything like enough to answer that fairly, so I accept he did what he thought best. He gave me a wonderful show at Newmarket, he will do that in Vegas. I am a fan and will remain one.

robgomm
18 Aug 2013, 18:23
I didn't see any posts. Did he have a go at Patti in this thread?

LucyK!
18 Aug 2013, 18:30
The posts were removed for a reason - I'm not sure someone re-posting the content would be helpful! :lol:

suzieq
18 Aug 2013, 19:29
Did he have a go at Patti in this thread?

No.

austukas
18 Aug 2013, 20:22
I had a long weekend waiting till I get home and see at least some pictures with Patti from the show and I find out, that she's no longer in the band. My heart is broken, because the reason I listened to Meat Loaf is gone...:(

Wario
18 Aug 2013, 20:27
My heart is broken, because the reason I listened to Meat Loaf is gone...:(

If you listed to ML for Patti, you were listening to Patti.

AndrewG
18 Aug 2013, 20:33
If you listed to ML for Patti, you were listening to Patti.


If I watch your Penguin movie it would be because of Batman. Does that mean you don't want me to watch your film?

Meat has an excellent band because that helps him. If it wouldn't matter then he could come on stage with a tape like a tribute act.

What anyone takes away from shows/CDs/photos etc is surely up to the fan. There is no rule book what we should like and how we should like it.

Breeze
18 Aug 2013, 20:56
I imagine most of us will get over it, b/c I am indeed buying Meat Loaf albums.

That does not mean we can just get this out of our rear view mirror instantly.

CarylB
18 Aug 2013, 21:00
If you listed to ML for Patti, you were listening to Patti.



I agree with this part of Warrio's reply to austukas. If Patti is why you followed Meat .. she still has a career, and I hope a very successful one. You can still follow her

The Flying Mouse
18 Aug 2013, 22:08
:twisted: I've requested R's permission to lock this thread down for 24 hours, which he's given.
I've been to work and let's say in depth moderation after too much rock n roll n brew isn't always the best idea :bleh:

I had a brief convo with Meat last night, and he offered me some of the story (in confidence) of what's happened.
Needless to say i'm not at liberty to repeat anything that has been said in PM to any third party.

Speculation, although completely natural for the fans of an artist when there is a change in the wind, doesn't help much.
Especially when it manifests itself as anger and finger pointing.
Although Meat has given me his confidence (to an extent) i'm far from having a full understanding of the situation myself.
I want a chance to go over the thread and clean up some of the more angry speculative posts, as well as some of the in fighting.


As for deleted posts, I can confirm that Meat has in no way or form posted anything disrespectful on this forum towards Patti, but was a result of the speculation that has occurred on the thread.

I personally believe that Meat's reluctance to comment on the matter at this time is evidence that he has no wish to air dirty laundry in public and show Patti any disrespect by posting his side of the story (no dig intended towards Patti for posting on Facebook).

Weather he posts any explanation at some future time is completely up to him.

At this time i'm reminded of a quote I read on this forum that I belive has special significance.

There are three sides to each story.

One side.

The other side.

And the truth.

Will aim to have this thread up and running again by tomorrow evening.

The Flying Mouse
19 Aug 2013, 19:35
:twisted: The mod stuff................

I've given the thread a good clean to get rid of some of the in fighting and some of the more angrily speculative posts.
I've tried to be as fair as possible to everyone concerned, but if something has been deleted you feel should have stayed up, mea culpa :shrug:

1st of all.
Yes, the thread belongs on the forum.
People here have a special interest in Meat, and Patti has been a big part of that for the last 20 years.
No more debate on weather this should be discussed on the forum.
Pandora has officially opened the box.
Let's deal with it the best we can in a rational manner rather than invest in a lifetime supply of elephant food (and a f*cking big pooper scooper :bleh: ).

With that in mind, may I remind you that we are not in full possession of the facts.
I wouldn't presume to know all the facts of what has gone on without asking Meat at least 20 questions, asking Patti an extra 20, and even then the truth would probably be somewhere in between.
See what Jonty's boss said about there being 3 sides to every argument.

As we don't know the full facts, please show some restraint when it comes to finger pointing and venting "disgust" at anybody involved to how and why Patti has been dismissed.
It's unfair.

We don't know if the termination email was the 1st or the 100'th correspondence between Meat & Patti on the subject.
Personally, I would be surprised if the first thing Patti knew about this was when she opened her emails.

If Meat and/or Patti should decide to give a full explanation as to what has happened, perhaps we can have a more informed opinion then.
Until that time, at least, try to keep an open mind.

While it's true that Meat posted in anger in the heat of the moment in response to what has been said on this thread, I can forgive him that as much as I can forgive the angry posts that prompted his response.
If folks were posting about me in such harsh terms with such little information, I would have said much worse than Meat. :bleh:
Meat's words have been deleted (within a very short time) by mutual agreement.
Reposting what Meat posted here is completely out of the question, and sharing what Meat said with who he posted to is nothing short of shit stirring and causing unnecessary upset IMO.
And it's not Meat's reputation i'm thinking of when I say that.
You might want to double check your motives before forwarding any deleted message.
On that matter, case closed. :lock:

IMHO.........

Personally, I agree that Patti's departure could have been handled better.
While it's true that it says Meat Loaf on the tickets, and it's a Meat Loaf concert you are paying to see, Meat knows how loved Patti is by the fans.
It's natural that fans should be disappointed and upset not to see Patti on stage with Meat.
That said, it's never a good day to break bad news, and let's be completely honest here, a simple "Patti has left the band, we wish her the best of luck" would not be the end of the matter. There would have been a whole new round of speculation and demand for answers.
Damned if you do, put in the wicker man if you don't :shrug:

An issue has obviously arisen, and perhaps, just perhaps, Meat has not said anything publicly because he feels that to post his point of view might be disrespectful to Patti?
While we all (well, not all of us) want answers, two opposing points of view being aired in public can turn very quickly into a slanging match.
It would be a real sorrow to see things end like that between them :sad:

While I personally doubt very much that the termination email was the first Patti was told on the subject, there are certain things that do have to be put in writing.
You may like your boss, might think of him as a friend, might even go for beers on a Friday night after work, but when it comes right down to it there are legal requirements when terminating somebody's employment.
Not nice, just a fact of life.

I for one do not believe that Meat is happy to see Patti gone.
Although things could have been handled differently in the last 3 weeks, 3 weeks is not an awful long time.
In the interview posted in this thread, Meat called Patti his "rock", and I don't think for a moment he was exaggerating or lying.
Try cutting off your right arm and see how much better you feel in 3 weeks time :shrug:

I can only repeat what I've said before...........

Patti: I'm very sorry to see you gone, and i'll always be grateful for the special times you have given me (keep your jokes to yourselves there folks :bleh: ).
I'm sure her career is far from over, and i'd LOVE to see some solo work.
Our loss is some other lucky sods gain.

Meat: I'm sorry to see you lose IMHO the best female foil you've had in your long career.


In summary........

Keep an open mind.

No off topic fighting.

Try and show some consideration for each other, Meat, and Patti.
This isn't easy on anyone.

I'm opening the thread again, but if we have more of the same it'll be deleted.

LucyK!
19 Aug 2013, 19:58
As we don't know the full facts, please show some restraint when it comes to finger pointing and venting "disgust" at anybody involved to how and why Patti has been dismissed.

Personally, I would be surprised (flabbergasted, actually) if the first thing Patti knew about this was when she opened her emails.

:shock: That's not gone well, huh...

The Flying Mouse
19 Aug 2013, 20:00
:shock: That's not gone well, huh...

:twisted: Why?
No fingers pointed, no disgust expressed.

LucyK!
19 Aug 2013, 20:05
Disgust no, but if you're flabbergasted at the thought that Patti's email was the first she knew of the termination then the implication is that she's received several others, and we're not meant to be pointing fingers or speculating as to how she was dismissed.

To be honest, if the thread is going to be edited to within an inch of its life then there's very little point in keeping it open.

The Flying Mouse
19 Aug 2013, 20:12
Disgust no, but if you're flabbergasted at the thought that Patti's email was the first she knew of the termination then the implication is that she's received several others, and we're not meant to be pointing fingers or speculating as to how she was dismissed.

To be honest, if the thread is going to be edited to within an inch of its life then there's very little point in keeping it open.

:twisted: The implication is that I have no idea how many times this was discussed by Meat and Patti, but i'd personally be surprised if the email in question was the first.

Speculative opinion? Yes.

Disrespectful or finger pointing at Meat or Patti? I hardly think so.

But if you think the word flabbergasted is a little strong, i'll delete it :shrug:

CarylB
19 Aug 2013, 20:26
.... i'd personally be surprised if the email in question was the first.

I would too. In fact I'd probably say my flabber would be a tad gasted ;) I cannot imagine that nothing was discussed or referred to beforehand, and you're right that certain things needs contractually to be put in writing. I don't take what you said as disrespectful or finger pointing at either party.

For me the biggest fact is that we don't know all the facts, and I don't see why we should expect to. Anything said by way of explanation would I think be argued or construed as disloyal or at best unkind/unfair. It's a private matter, however much any of us feels we care about either or both people involved, and is better kept private.

And I agree, any form of announcement would simply have brought all this forward 3 weeks, or by whatever time it was made.

The Flying Mouse
19 Aug 2013, 20:35
I don't take what you said as disrespectful or finger pointing at either party.


:twisted: And it certainly wasn't my intention.
I have enormous respect and love for both Patti and Meat, and I would be horrified if either of them found something offensive in my words.

The Flying Mouse
19 Aug 2013, 20:47
:twisted: Stretch's post moved here (http://www.mlukfc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19328).

Think it's best moved to it's own thread rather than being discussed here :up:

stretch37
19 Aug 2013, 20:53
:twisted: Stretch's post moved here (http://www.mlukfc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19328).

Think it's best moved to it's own thread rather than being discussed here :up:

I was thinking the same :-P Thanks Mouse :cool:

Adje
19 Aug 2013, 20:53
Ough,

I guess it's fingerpointing but Mouse, don't ever consider a job as an editor... :| And I don't mean that in a funny way.

Wario
19 Aug 2013, 22:58
wow.... just wow. Just delete this thread.

Sebastian.
19 Aug 2013, 23:05
Not a good idea to read this thread after 12 hours of plane travel. My brain hurts.

CarylB
19 Aug 2013, 23:08
Not a good idea to read this thread after 12 hours of plane travel. My brain hurts.

But you've arrived safely :-)

The Flying Mouse
19 Aug 2013, 23:53
Ough,

I guess it's fingerpointing but Mouse, don't ever consider a job as an editor... :| And I don't mean that in a funny way.

:twisted: Sorry you don't like the edit.
I had to get the machete out at times :bleh:

When it comes to an edit of a long thread with long posts, it's a bit like taking an empty glass and pouring a random amount of water into it.
Ask for opinions and half the people will say you poured too much water.
The others will say not enough.
Some folks on both sides will say you spilt some and it's a bit messy.


wow.... just wow. Just delete this thread.

Did I spill the water? :bleh:

Not a good idea to read this thread after 12 hours of plane travel. My brain hurts.

The unedited version could have lasted you the whole trip. :shock:

hairyone
20 Aug 2013, 00:14
I wouldn't normally get involved in a thread of this nature but I feel I must (I have a feeling I may lose some friends in the next 30 seconds!).

Whatever the reasons, whatever the facts - my view is quite simple - without Patti the last two shows I have seen Meat in would not have been acceptable.

We all love the legend that is Meat but it would be blind loyalty to not recognise that the vocals in 2013 are the not the same as the vocals recorded 36 years ago for example.

It would be unfair to say Patti carried the show, but there can be no doubt that her performance in particular meant that the more casual person perhaps coming to their first ever Meat show heard vocals which meant a great show took place.

Now I didn't see the shows this weekend so I cannot say how the new people were, but I am fairly confident they wouldn't be at the same level (and it would be unreasonable to expect that with such little rehearsal time).

However without that rapport which comes with 2 decades of working together it will lead to, in my view, a show which will not be at the level people would expect. Having a great band helps (and having people like Paul on guitar certainly helps) but I worry that without that rapport putting on an arena show will be very difficult.

That said the next engagement is clearly very different and it may be that actually that rapport isn't needed at all.

In conclusion

1 - We all love Meat
2 - We all love Patti
3 - We are all sad at the news
4 - None of us know what has (or hasn't) been said
5 - Some think that arena shows will be far worse without Patti

Wario
20 Aug 2013, 00:25
Did I spill the water? :bleh:
The unedited version could have lasted you the whole trip. :shock:

No its nothing personal Neil.
Just when a thread is edited this much .... its best to just either lock and/or delete it.

This is like the censored version of HCTB.

duke knooby
20 Aug 2013, 00:39
better title

CarylB
20 Aug 2013, 00:59
better title

Yes .. I need no longer think an email from Marie Stopes is coming into my mailbox!

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 00:59
Wasn't this absolutely never ever going to happen again? Well, there you have it.

CarylB
20 Aug 2013, 01:30
In conclusion

1 - We all love Meat
2 - We all love Patti
3 - We are all sad at the news
4 - None of us know what has (or hasn't) been said
5 - Some think that arena shows will be far worse without Patti

Can't see why you should lose friends from a reasoned and reasonable post :-)

Wouldn't disagree with any of the above points. I'm not one of the some in Point 5, think it's early to judge that anyway, and I can't see me being at any arena shows for arguably a year, if at all. If they happen everyone can judge .. but I was at Newmarket and in no way could I say the show was far worse. Different, and of course I missed Patti, but it was still a great show.

Meat's never sounded like to me he did on the recording 36 years ago, and I would never suggest that. But his vocals delight me still, particularly since the vocal cyst healed. He was very strong vocally at Newmarket in my view. Actually I rather enjoyed seeing him really carrying the show vocally this time ;) .. and the new vocalists were very good imo, and will only get better over time I think. The dramatic interpretation was good, particularly considering their newness to the songs, and I'd expect more ease and rapport to develop rapidly with time. I'm not suggesting anyone is likely to develop that intuitive closeness on stage that Patti had with Meat, but were any arena shows to be announced tomorrow I'd be there on-line when TM started selling, and based on Newmarket I'd look forward to going with the same excitement and pleasure I always do :-)

And you're right .. those people in the audience who hadn't seen a Meat show, or hadn't for some years (and there were very many of them .. arguably a majority) simply experienced a great show of Meat's unique style. A huge number of first-timers or those who haven't seen him in years, have been coming and saying just that on his FB page.

renegadeangel
20 Aug 2013, 01:59
:twisted: I've requested R's permission to lock this thread down for 24 hours, which he's given.
I've been to work and let's say in depth moderation after too much rock n roll n brew isn't always the best idea :bleh:

I had a brief convo with Meat last night, and he offered me some of the story (in confidence) of what's happened.
Needless to say i'm not at liberty to repeat anything that has been said in PM to any third party.

Speculation, although completely natural for the fans of an artist when there is a change in the wind, doesn't help much.
Especially when it manifests itself as anger and finger pointing.
Although Meat has given me his confidence (to an extent) i'm far from having a full understanding of the situation myself.
I want a chance to go over the thread and clean up some of the more angry speculative posts, as well as some of the in fighting.


As for deleted posts, I can confirm that Meat has in no way or form posted anything disrespectful on this forum towards Patti, but was a result of the speculation that has occurred on the thread.

I personally believe that Meat's reluctance to comment on the matter at this time is evidence that he has no wish to air dirty laundry in public and show Patti any disrespect by posting his side of the story (no dig intended towards Patti for posting on Facebook).

Weather he posts any explanation at some future time is completely up to him.

At this time i'm reminded of a quote I read on this forum that I belive has special significance.

There are three sides to each story.

One side.

The other side.

And the truth.

Will aim to have this thread up and running again by tomorrow evening.

Sorry but now your just adding fuel to the fire. Why bother to go on about a private conversation with Meat when of course it's just going to add to the speculation.
Doesn't matter who said what to whom or why. It's Meat's band and he is the boss. He can do what he likes.
Should probably have left the thread locked if you decided it needed to be cleaned with a machete.
I'm not having a go at you but in truth there is so much more interesting things to talk about than this...

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 02:27
Does anyone have a link to the interview where it was said that Patti was back to stay and the mistake of letting her go would not happen again? It was a legitimate public interview, so I do not feel out of line asking about it. I want to hear it straight from the source verbatim.

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 02:34
Does anyone have a link to the interview where it was said that Patti was back to stay and the mistake of letting her go would not happen again? It was a legitimate public interview, so I do not feel out of line asking about it. I want to hear it straight from the source verbatim.

Sure dude ;) Go to 1:05

t4xQVZ1oZFo

lorenzoduke
20 Aug 2013, 02:38
Does anyone have a link to the interview where it was said that Patti was back to stay and the mistake of letting her go would not happen again? It was a legitimate public interview, so I do not feel out of line asking about it. I want to hear it straight from the source verbatim.

Let's face it, that promise/statement was probably meant sincerely at the time when things were going well. Other promises/statements to the members of this forum made during the last round of outbursts came to nothing too, as far as I'm aware. At a certain point you just have to take certain things with a pinch of salt. Priorities change.

Mr. Happy
20 Aug 2013, 05:03
No offense to the "he said this wouldn't happen again!" crowd, but to be fair that's a bit ridiculous. That was two years ago, who knows what's changed since then which might have led up to this?

Whatever the reasons, whatever the facts - my view is quite simple - without Patti the last two shows I have seen Meat in would not have been acceptable.

I don't disagree with you, but at the same time he does have two new vocalists to fill that role on stage, both who sound pretty amazing from what I've heard on YouTube. It's not like he's suddenly all alone in carrying the show.

Also, this has to be one of the most neutered thread in the history of this forum, if I'm not misremembering how many posts were in the first half of the thread pre-edit. Not passing judgement on it, just observing :shock:

cujo
20 Aug 2013, 05:20
Do you know what really p***** me off. While this thread was locked I started one inviting people to share their thanks to Patti, and it got 5 replies, whereas a good argument is up to 5 pages. No wonder I rarely bother to post here. FFS people are we hear to enjoy music and praise the people involved or is it just so we can over analyse and tear things apart.

Monstro
20 Aug 2013, 05:27
Do you know what really p***** me off. While this thread was locked I started one inviting people to share their thanks to Patti, and it got 5 replies, whereas a good argument is up to 5 pages. No wonder I rarely bother to post here. FFS people are we hear to enjoy music and praise the people involved or is it just so we can over analyse and tear things apart.

Nothing gets folks going like an argument, easier to post a negative than a positive and posters get more replies to a negative post than a positive, sad innit.

Wario
20 Aug 2013, 06:02
Nothing gets folks going like an argument, easier to post a negative than a positive and posters get more replies to a negative post than a positive, sad innit.

I like arguments. its interesting to read. :lurk:

and get involved :kickass:

Cause in the end nobodies mad at me forever.

Breeze
20 Aug 2013, 06:39
Patti has one of those Patti Russo forever type closed groups. it is on face book and you just ask to join and a very nice person OK's it quickly and then you can tell Patti how much she has meant to you.Patti is in the group and it has a mod.

melon
20 Aug 2013, 09:45
Cause in the end nobodies mad at me forever.

Could still happen....

The Flying Mouse
20 Aug 2013, 13:28
Sorry but now your just adding fuel to the fire. Why bother to go on about a private conversation with Meat when of course it's just going to add to the speculation.


:twisted: I'm the first to admit that that was a bad judgement call.
It was a misjudged attempt to reassure the members that i'd be editing the thread as fairly as possible to everybody and with some context.
Well, from reading the forum I can see that that one came back to bite me in the ass :facepalm:
Welcome to the internet, where motives are twisted and all good intentions lead to the dog house.

So for what it's worth, it was a bad call on my part, and i'm sorry for that.



Should probably have left the thread locked if you decided it needed to be cleaned with a machete.


I'm reading a lot of posts like that :bleh:
But go invent some wormhole technology, skip to an alternative dimension where I just deleted the thread, and see how many complaints that would have got.

Add to this...............

When it comes to an edit of a long thread with long posts, it's a bit like taking an empty glass and pouring a random amount of water into it.
Ask for opinions and half the people will say you poured too much water.
The others will say not enough.
Some folks on both sides will say you spilt some and it's a bit messy.

...........there'll also be folks who will tell you you didn't need to put any water in the glass, and some will say you should have took the glass off the table.

It's big news, no doubt, and there's no reason not to discuss it as long as we can all put our anger on the back burner a little until such time (if) more information is offered.


Do you know what really p***** me off. While this thread was locked I started one inviting people to share their thanks to Patti, and it got 5 replies, whereas a good argument is up to 5 pages. No wonder I rarely bother to post here. FFS people are we hear to enjoy music and praise the people involved or is it just so we can over analyse and tear things apart.


To be fair mate, I think that the fact it was posted on here that Patti doesn't visit the forum, and folks would be better off sending her messages of support on facebook, has a lot more to do with why there are not more messages on the thread rather than people not caring.
That said, there is nothing wrong with a public show of thanks, even if she doesn't get to see those messages.
I for one will be more than happy to post my thanks and best wishes in the thread.


Cause in the end nobodies mad at me forever.

That's what you think :kickass: :p :lol:

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 13:30
No offense to the "he said this wouldn't happen again!" crowd, but to be fair that's a bit ridiculous. That was two years ago, who knows what's changed since then which might have led up to this?

None taken, but if it is true that it happened via email then I think it speaks volumes. I know it is a "personnel matter" which is always convenient, but I think her fans should have gotten some explanation. No offense to the "owes us nothing" crowd, but I've spent good money to see her as part of the band and this does impact my thoughts toward future purchases to be honest.. and I know the "don't let the door hit ya" crowd is about too, so have at it.
I just find it from what has been stated in public very tacky (via email). Also, I personally am extremely careful about what I say will "never" happen to people. It was on a documentary so i feel like it was said for the fans to be reassuring. That is why they say "never say never".
"Is a promise something people used to keep".

meatrocks1
20 Aug 2013, 15:48
such a shame and disgrace.......hate to say it but this is going to come back and bite him in the ass big time.....patti was the icing on the cake.....thank you patti for 20 yrs of awesomeness..........

Meat Loaf_fan
20 Aug 2013, 16:11
Thank you Patii. :heart: Good luck! :up:


+++++

... patti was the icing on the cake ...

Didn't you forget someone? What about: Paul Crook, Randy Flowers, Justin Avery, Danny Miranda or John Miceli? :kickass:

ShelbyLee
20 Aug 2013, 16:18
*Patti said she was terminated by email at the end of July (which is roughly 2,5 to 3,5 weeks before the shows in the UK = an average of 3 weeks) *FACT


* Meat stated here that the girls had one rehearsal. *FACT

- And despite the fact if you think they did or did not perform well (I give you that this is a personal opinion that I share with many people I have contact with - most of them attending one or both shows btw), Meat must have rememberd how Aspen got received. Or more so, how the response was on missing Patti on the band. And with this knowledge you don't throw them before the lions with one practice round. If you are a pro and if you care for them, the performance and the audience you take longer practice time. If you are a professional that cares for your performance you make sure you get more than 1 rehearsal in 3 weeks. It can be done, if you really want it to. Instead of working on the Vegas shows, work with them on these two shows as it's their first introduction to the crowd...

*No announcement was made *FACT

- And, even if it's his right to not do so, thus reactions like this (again, remember the first time they departed in 2007) were to be expected. Meat knew the emotions of those fans and yet decided to ignore them. It's a choise he made. But don't come 'boo-hooing' on here as if it's no big deal. It was a big deal then, so it's no surprise it still is a big deal.


This makes me rethink so many things as a longtime fan. I don't understand how anyone can terminate a "friend" in an email. Just like in 2007, there is no "thank you" for 20 fabulous years. Everyone who has been to a Meat show knows that Patti did her job phenomenally, so what is the reason? Her age? Money?

I wish Patti all the best. Much thanks and respect to Patti because she deserves it for everything she has given the fans onstage for 20 years.

Evil One
20 Aug 2013, 16:25
so what is the reason? Her age? Money?Nobody knows. Patti could have been caught pissing in Meat's suitcase for all we know. :shrug:

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 16:38
Nobody knows. Patti could have been caught pissing in Meat's suitcase for all we know. :shrug:

And for all we will probably ever know. To use a wrestling term, I hope Patti does a "shoot", but I guess she is concerned it would cost her future job opportunities. I don't expect the straight scoop from anybody to be honest. Looking back to when it happened before and what was said afterwards there are going to be a lot of unhappy people. I know how to express myself in brave and crazy ways.

tonyloaf
20 Aug 2013, 17:00
such a shame and disgrace.......hate to say it but this is going to come back and bite him in the ass big time.....patti was the icing on the cake.....thank you patti for 20 yrs of awesomeness..........

Unless you know inside information , that Is not right to say

melon
20 Aug 2013, 17:03
This makes me rethink so many things as a longtime fan. I don't understand how anyone can terminate a "friend" in an email. Just like in 2007, there is no "thank you" for 20 fabulous years. Everyone who has been to a Meat show knows that Patti did her job phenomenally, so what is the reason? Her age? Money?

I wish Patti all the best. Much thanks and respect to Patti because she deserves it for everything she has given the fans onstage for 20 years.

You don't know that the email was the first correspondance on the matter

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

ShelbyLee
20 Aug 2013, 17:31
You don't know that the email was the first correspondance on the matter

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

Regardless of the email, just like in 2007, she is treated as if she doesn't exist anymore. Where is the "thank you" for 20 years of great service and friendship? Where are the best wishes for the future? It is a simple thing to do for band members who have been loyal for so many years.

melon
20 Aug 2013, 17:37
Regardless of the email, just like in 2007, she is treated as if she doesn't exist anymore. Where is the "thank you" for 20 years of great service and friendship? Where are the best wishes for the future? It is a simple thing to do for band members who have been loyal for so many years.

Maybe its not permanent? We don't know.

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Forum Runner

meatrocks1
20 Aug 2013, 17:40
oh pulleze how is it not right not to say.....countless fans remember the last time it happened......and now again........the lady deserves better respect.....than an email......but its okay for meat to tell people to ~~~~ off and ramble on ....i just saying he so close to retiring.....the timing is not right to let patti go.....i am intitled to my opinion and i think this is going to hurt his remaining touring time that is left......


Unless you know inside information , that Is not right to say

Dave
20 Aug 2013, 18:04
You don't know that the email was the first correspondance on the matter



Same as you don't know that it wasn't.

melon
20 Aug 2013, 18:07
oh pulleze how is it not right not to say.....countless fans remember the last time it happened......and now again........the lady deserves better respect.....than an email......but its okay for meat to tell people to ~~~~ off and ramble on ....i just saying he so close to retiring.....the timing is not right to let patti go.....i am intitled to my opinion and i think this is going to hurt his remaining touring time that is left......

No one knows what really happened, or the reasons behind it, but if you read a bit further back in this thread, you'll see it was not long ago cleaned up for the same as you've just posted, so best to leave it there.

tonyloaf
20 Aug 2013, 18:26
oh pulleze how is it not right not to say.....countless fans remember the last time it happened......and now again........the lady deserves better respect.....than an email......but its okay for meat to tell people to ~~~~ off and ramble on ....i just saying he so close to retiring.....the timing is not right to let patti go.....i am intitled to my opinion and i think this is going to hurt his remaining touring time that is left......

Close to retiring? New album on the way and shows in Vegas ? Like I said if you have inside knowledge fair enough but if you don't then it's wrong

meatrocks1
20 Aug 2013, 19:25
so how is it not wrong for meat to tell people to f-off.....thats real classy....we buy his albums...support him....buy concert tix.......and people get told to f-off......so other words without us there be no him......don't you think we deserve a little more respect.......he owes an apology to some people myself included.....

wizardofodd
20 Aug 2013, 19:31
I'm not going to speculate, I dont know the facts. But patti was one of a kind, Amazing, incredible. It's sad. Show business is a cruel world. I dont know Patti, I dont know Meat- So I wont assume something is out of character or point fingers. I just enjoy the music, and that is why this is sad news because for me the music (from a live perspective especially) Just wont be the same.

Leah
20 Aug 2013, 19:48
Hmm I wonder what the other members of the band think of patti's exit, at the end of the day meats the boss but I wonder if its affected morale or anything.....just a thought.....

Wario
20 Aug 2013, 20:19
The only regret to me right now is we never did get Bible and a Beer released....

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 20:39
No one knows what really happened, or the reasons behind it, but if you read a bit further back in this thread, you'll see it was not long ago cleaned up for the same as you've just posted, so best to leave it there.

"Cleaned up" is that what they call it now?

Leah
20 Aug 2013, 20:42
Thankyou for posting meat and clarifying a few things up, yes it's none of our business as to what goes on behind closed doors and maybe this will stop some of the speculations that have been going on. I was at Newbury and thought you played an ace show even though I was shocked at no patti and 2 new ladies!!!
I'm sure everything happens for a reason :0) best of luck with Vegas

Wario
20 Aug 2013, 20:44
Yes I am pissed off at some people on here !! They are not fans . Thank You Tonyloaf and Lucy and Andy, Flying Mouse , evil one and others. One email are you kidding me , what a joke that is !!! I SEE REALLY DUMB PEOPLE !!

Looking at the positives man, did you chose the blondes as a homage to the blind before I stop tour? Its sad Patis gone, but I'm glad the Goffs are getting a call back with these new girls.

Plus, they sound really good.

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 20:44
maybe I deserve better respect.

Just as maybe a large group of your fans did, before they bought a ticket to find this was 'not the band they payed for' - so to speak...

Wario
20 Aug 2013, 20:48
Just as maybe a large group of your fans did, before they bought a ticket to find this was 'not the band they payed for' - so to speak...

Thats where I get off on the train. the band they payed for was Meat Loaf. No false adverting as far as I'm concerned.
Unless they were there exclusively JUST for patti, they got a fairly full set with Patootie and outside which haven't been played in over a year.

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 20:48
Yes I am pissed off at some people on here !! They are not fans . Thank You Tonyloaf and Lucy and Andy, Flying Mouse , evil one and others. One email are you kidding me , what a joke that is !!! I SEE REALLY DUMB PEOPLE , MEATROCKS1!!

The only story we have to go on mentions the email. That comes from a party directly involved. We have no other comment to base off of. I guess I'm dumb. Oh well. Nice to support someone since 1978 and get called dumb for going with what you know - it is not like it was a second-hand rumor.

JennaG
20 Aug 2013, 20:49
Just as maybe a large group of your fans did, before they bought a ticket to find this was 'not the band they payed for' - so to speak...

Perhaps I'm in the minority but I bought a ticket to see MEAT LOAF and MEAT LOAF was who I saw.

Fire Ball
20 Aug 2013, 20:53
Thank you Wario....
Looking at the positives man, did you chose the blondes as a homage to the blind before I stop tour? Its sad Patis gone, but I'm glad the Goffs are getting a call back with these new girls.

Plus, they sound really good.

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 20:53
Hey where did the "dumb people" post go? Kind of reminds me of times gone by when we were percentages.

Leah
20 Aug 2013, 20:53
Perhaps I'm in the minority but I bought a ticket to see MEAT LOAF and MEAT LOAF was who I saw.

Same here, I think those of us who know who patti is was disappointed she wasn't there but ultimately we were there to see meat and I was down the front for the show so I was happy as larry overall :0)

Yevonda
20 Aug 2013, 20:55
The funny thing (in an ironic way) is no matter what Meat does or doesn't do, says or doesn't say, he is at blame. I find that to be rather sad.

If he came out and made the announcement that Patti left the band people would have complained about what ever explanation Meat gave. Meat doesn't say anything and everyone is complaining about no explanation.

Why can't we accept the fact that Patti isn't in the band, yes it is sad but life really does go on!

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 20:55
Thats where I get off on the train. the band they payed for was Meat Loaf. No false adverting as far as I'm concerned.
Unless they were there exclusively JUST for patti, they got a fairly full set with Patootie and outside which haven't been played in over a year.

Yes and people don't go to Bon Jovi for Ricky Samboa (well not anymore :-P )

Meat Loaf brings his band, they are called the Neverland Express. There are members in that band that hae their own followers and fans. Otherwise Meat Loaf could take a soundmix machine on the stage and do one hell of a karaoke show...

Changing not just a member in the band but perhaps, for fans, the most specific one after Meat, you don't keep that hidden for the fans until concert day.

Not if you want to do the decent thing.

3 weeks with a team and no-one could think of two lines to say Patti no longer a member?

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 20:58
The funny thing (in an ironic way) is no matter what Meat does or doesn't do, says or doesn't say, he is at blame. I find that to be rather sad.



Yes and calling your longtime fans "dumb people" is a great way to fix it. I've defended him through the AFL debacle and God knows what else and I guess I was dumb. So maybe he's right.

Yevonda
20 Aug 2013, 21:02
Yes and calling your longtime fans "dumb people" is a great way to fix it. I've defended him through the AFL debacle and God knows what else and I guess I was dumb. So maybe he's right.

I can't speak for Meat with regard to the 'dumb people' comment but I think he was referring to the people who honestly believe that this all happened with one email. I have no idea what happened but common sense would tell someone that a 20 year working relationship was not terminated in one email. I think that is what he meant and I would agree with him.

nikox1
20 Aug 2013, 21:03
As I said before its sad patti is gone, but what has happened has happened. Meat does not feel he needs to tell anybody all the gory bits etc etc,, it's a private matter between I guess a boss and he's employee? Some think there should have been an announcement, yet others are fine with it. Maybe it was somebody else's decision? Nobody on here is made to tell what goes on in there private lives. It's done, lets move on and see what magic jim and meat can produce in the future?

Evil One
20 Aug 2013, 21:07
Yes I am pissed off at some people on here !! They are not fans . Thank You Tonyloaf and Lucy and Andy, Flying Mouse , evil one and others. One email are you kidding me , what a joke that is !!! I SEE REALLY DUMB PEOPLE !!Is this a sign the apocalypse is near? :yikes:

loaferman61
20 Aug 2013, 21:08
As I said before its sad patti is gone, but what has happened has happened. Meat does not feel he needs to tell anybody all the gory bits etc etc,, it's a private matter between I guess a boss and he's employee? Some think there should have been an announcement, yet others are fine with it. Maybe it was somebody else's decision? Nobody on here is made to tell what goes on in there private lives. It's done, lets move on and see what magic jim and meat can produce in the future?

Supposedly it was someone else's decision before. We can't pretend that we haven't heard one side comment in public and the other reply with a "dumb people" comment. Call me crazy but I don't buy products from people who insult their die-hard fans.

AndrewG
20 Aug 2013, 21:11
Just as maybe a large group of your fans did, before they bought a ticket to find this was 'not the band they payed for' - so to speak...

To be fair, there was no official indication Patti would actually have been at the racecourse shows in the first place really. It already had been said the shows would be shorter and there was definitely less build up to the entire thing. Meat could have come on the stage with a smaller version of the NLE and it would not have surprised me.

I couldn't make the show on Friday and Saturday became difficult in the end as well. If I had went on Friday and not seen Patti I wouldn't have thought the world of it at the time.

I certainly wouldn't have been upset about the money thing, but that's just a personal thing. Have I been surprised/upset about the stuff on the internet? - Yes. It's been a collaboration of 20 years. Maybe it's best not knowing what's going on sometimes now I that I think of it. :shrug:

Guy
20 Aug 2013, 21:13
Can this be put to bed now?

meatrocks1
20 Aug 2013, 21:17
i really happy to hear that he thinks his fans are dumb.......geez almighty.......come on Meat......

Sebastian.
20 Aug 2013, 21:17
I think everyone just loves Patti as it's been 20 years and she has a brilliant stage presence, sure I'll miss her.


However the new girls are great and have a huge amount of talent and bring their own thing to the stage. Reading Lyssa's FB page she seems over the moon to be working with Meat.

nikox1
20 Aug 2013, 21:17
Supposedly it was someone else's decision before. We can't pretend that we haven't heard one side comment in public and the other reply with a "dumb people" comment. Call me crazy but I don't buy products from people who insult their die-hard fans.

I was not online at the time of meats comments? I did not see them? I'm sure whoever they were directed at were obviously offended and rightly so. But I will not force an issue that is 1. Not my bizzness 2. Out of my control

Gez
20 Aug 2013, 21:18
The only regret to me right now is we never did get Bible and a Beer released....

Ditto, excellent song :boohoo:

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 21:20
To be fair, there was no official indication Patti would actually have been at the racecourse shows in the first place really.

Nor that she wouldn't actually. I love how you try to get an oposite perspective on things but really, when was the last time Meat did a show of 90 minutes without the entire band? It's not like this was a 5 minute tv performance or anything.

If anything it's more likely that people expected the entire band to show up...

Fire Ball
20 Aug 2013, 21:20
Why am I upset , I have been insulted my integrity has been attacked .. As if this really happened with one e-mail . Yes, I find that a very stupid assumption. I know that nothing should have to be posted here before the shows. For various reasons . Also most the the 37.000 people that were at the 2 shows don't come here . Do any of you understand the world we live in. For the first time in my history on "Last at Bat" I had to have security because of threats .I had to get a restraining order put in place. I really don't need to be insulted when I come here. I get enough insults from places that don't say Meat Loaf Fan club. As far as people defending me in all matters thank you.
Meat

Guy
20 Aug 2013, 21:22
Can this be put to bed now?
Obviously not Guy. Go back to thinking about the wonderful shows you have coming up in Las Vegas with ML

AndrewG
20 Aug 2013, 21:23
Nor that she wouldn't actually. I love how you try to get an oposite perspective on things but really, when was the last time Meat did a show of 90 minutes without the entire band? It's not like this was a 5 minute tv performance or anything.

If anything it's more likely that people expected the entire band to show up...

Fair enough. I see your point.

Gez
20 Aug 2013, 21:24
You know guys, I go to a Meat gig to see Meat Loaf, Patti was a bonus but even if there was no female singers or even just Meat with a mic and a guitar........then I'm there :up:

JennaG
20 Aug 2013, 21:29
Why am I upset , I have been insulted my integrity has been attacked .. As if this really happened with one e-mail . Yes, I find that a very stupid assumption.

I for one can see precisely why you are upset and I do not blame you for feeling the way you do. I think what has happened just goes to show the dangers of people commenting and passing judgement when they do not know the full story. I don't feel that we have the right to demand or expect the full story because at the end of the day this IS a private matter.

I buy a record and in exchange for that I get to listen to that record, I buy a concert ticket and in exchange for that I get to see the show. I don't feel that it entitles me to make demands upon another person just because I have done that.

As far as people defending me in all matters thank you.

It's my pleasure.

Gez
20 Aug 2013, 21:29
Do any of you understand the world we live in. For the first time in my history on "Last at Bat" I had to have security because of threats .I had to get a restraining order put in place.
Meat


Wow thats unbelievable.....and you still did the M&G's.....suppose thats a big thanks from myself and your fans on here Meat who had a blast meeting you again !!

tonyloaf
20 Aug 2013, 21:31
i really happy to hear that he thinks his fans are dumb.......geez almighty.......come on Meat......

He is not saying that, but to say harsh comments without knowing the facts IS dumb end of.

AndrewG
20 Aug 2013, 21:31
Wow thats unbelievable.....and you still did the M&G's.....suppose thats a big thanks from myself and your fans on here Meat who had a blast meeting you again !!

:up:

Very true!
Thank you Meat, especially in those circumstances.

Guy
20 Aug 2013, 21:32
We might not be able to put it to bed, but you may feel something under the rug later, look for the broom in the corner.
I shall sleep tonight with one eye open.:O

nikox1
20 Aug 2013, 21:33
It's so simple really, people liked patti very much!!!! Me included. As a live performer with meat, she was great. But things change for lots of reasons? This is life!!! There were two huge shows to perform and meat and the rest of the band went and did there jobs. From what I heard the new girls did ok? I can understand people being disappointed etc etc, but I have to say that meat in no way has to explain what happened. Really as a musician and actor I follow meat and buy he's stuff., attend concerts. But that's we're it stops!!! He has a private life and also a business life that has nothing to do with me? Simple. And coming on here to explain what happened ( I'm sure it was not an easy decision ) is something meat in my opinion does not have to do. All the rumours about jim and meat down the years? The same applies = it's between two friends.

Vickip
20 Aug 2013, 21:33
Why am I upset , I have been insulted my integrity has been attacked .. As if this really happened with one e-mail . Yes, I find that a very stupid assumption. I know that nothing should have to be posted here before the shows. For various reasons . Also most the the 37.000 people that were at the 2 shows don't come here . Do any of you understand the world we live in. For the first time in my history on "Last at Bat" I had to have security because of threats .I had to get a restraining order put in place. I really don't need to be insulted when I come here. I get enough insults from places that don't say Meat Loaf Fan club. As far as people defending me in all matters thank you.
Meat

I just want to say I'm truly sorry to hear about the threats and the restraining order Meat :( I will not get involved in the discussion ... but please know that I'll always defend and support you no matter what. You're very welcome Meat, and thank you too.

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 21:34
I really don't need to be insulted when I come here. I get enough insults from places that don't say Meat Loaf Fan club. As far as people defending me in all matters thank you.
Meat
Fair enough. But getting respect isn't a one way street.

The assumption that people think its about ONE mail is also a false one. And very clear in the replies in here (although some have been butchered in the cutting room). I think I had it put into the right words, from my perspective, explaining what my personal issues with the entire situation are. Again, bad editing makes it perhaps less clear but the assumption this is about ONE e-mail is nonetheless a false one.

ninja
20 Aug 2013, 21:35
Why am I upset , I have been insulted my integrity has been attacked .. As if this really happened with one e-mail . Yes, I find that a very stupid assumption. I know that nothing should have to be posted here before the shows. For various reasons . Also most the the 37.000 people that were at the 2 shows don't come here . Do any of you understand the world we live in. For the first time in my history on "Last at Bat" I had to have security because of threats .I had to get a restraining order put in place. I really don't need to be insulted when I come here. I get enough insults from places that don't say Meat Loaf Fan club. As far as people defending me in all matters thank you.
Meat

That's such a shame and I'm upset too, Meat! I've been at both shows and both shows were outstanding, not to say beyond words. I've never seen so much power, energy and passion, it's just unbelievable. The two ladies are amazing too, I really like them. Enough said. Love you, Irene.

Fire Ball
20 Aug 2013, 21:35
We are thinking of doing a show with just Justin , Randy and one girl !! It has been brought up it would be be mostly a speaking tour !!
Meat

You know guys, I go to a Meat gig to see Meat Loaf, Patti was a bonus but even if there was no female singers or even just Meat with a mic and a guitar........then I'm there :up:

Gez
20 Aug 2013, 21:40
We are thinking of doing a show with just Justin , Randy and one girl !! It has been brought up it would be be mostly a speaking tour !!
Meat

OMG, that would be fantastic :up:

nikox1
20 Aug 2013, 21:40
On a more positive note!!!! Any news on the album meat? Worth ago😄

emma811981
20 Aug 2013, 21:43
We are thinking of doing a show with just Justin , Randy and one girl !! It has been brought up it would be be mostly a speaking tour !!
Meat

THAT WOULD BE BRILLIANT :D X

Monstro
20 Aug 2013, 21:43
Discussion about Moderating moved to feedback central

Vickip
20 Aug 2013, 21:44
THAT WOULD BE BRILLIANT :D X

I second that ... I wonder if we could get Randy to finally take his shirt off ? :-P

Tina.K.
20 Aug 2013, 21:46
We are thinking of doing a show with just Justin , Randy and one girl !! It has been brought up it would be be mostly a speaking tour !!
Meat

JUMP JUMP !!!!
Where? Vegas? or a new show next year?

Guy
20 Aug 2013, 21:48
Sending happy positive vibes people. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

suzieq
20 Aug 2013, 21:49
I second that ... I wonder if we could get Randy to finally take his shirt off ? :-P

:nope: With only Justin, Randy and one girl.....Meat takes his shirt off ! :devil:

Evil One
20 Aug 2013, 21:51
I'd prefer more Last At Bat personally. That show was the bollocks.

emma811981
20 Aug 2013, 21:52
:nope: With only Justin, Randy and one girl.....Meat takes his shirt off ! :devil:

hahaha glad it wasnt just me that had that thought pmsl :D

Monstro
20 Aug 2013, 21:53
I second that ... I wonder if we could get Randy to finally take his shirt off ? :-P

Meat did say that if the fb page got a thousand likes he'd make him do it

Gez
20 Aug 2013, 21:56
Sending happy positive vibes people. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Bet you've got a beer in hand :cheers:

wolfy35
20 Aug 2013, 22:09
Close to retiring? New album on the way and shows in Vegas ? Like I said if you have inside knowledge fair enough but if you don't then it's wrong

To be fair Meat has said he is retiring, from touring at least. He stated publicly I believe on here that after the other dates are done it would be a Vegas run then maybe some other US shows with I believe as it was planned at the time a final show in NY possibly Beacon Theatre.

On the flip side initially there were dates in places like SA & the far east / India spoken about that would happen before a Vegas run & they have not happened so if they will or not is anyones guess.

Fire Ball
20 Aug 2013, 22:17
It is when people make it a one way street. I will be more than happy to find your quote , where you showed me none !! If you really want to go down that road .
Meat

Fair enough. But getting respect isn't a one way street.

The assumption that people think its about ONE mail is also a false one. And very clear in the replies in here (although some have been butchered in the cutting room). I think I had it put into the right words, from my perspective, explaining what my personal issues with the entire situation are. Again, bad editing makes it perhaps less clear but the assumption this is about ONE e-mail is nonetheless a false one.

Leah
20 Aug 2013, 22:21
We are thinking of doing a show with just Justin , Randy and one girl !! It has been brought up it would be be mostly a speaking tour !!
Meat

Ermm can I be that one girl please?! ;0)

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 22:21
I will be more than happy to find your quote , where you showed me none !! If you really want to go down that road .
Meat

Well there are several from me on this board. You shouldn't have a hard time finding them ;)

Besides that, you're taking me on the road. Basically I'm your passenger. That doesn't mean I have to agree with everything. I'm a passenger, not a follower... :cool:

Fire Ball
20 Aug 2013, 22:23
There are so many things being tossed around I can't keep up , finishing the album is a must. Really like the idea of the run on Broadway and the West end . When we were in Austin putting the Vegas show together it was running almost 3 and a half hours. Vegas don't like that !! So then we started talking about a speaking tour. They are looking into it. That's not like a singing tour trust me !!
Meat

To be fair Meat has said he is retiring, from touring at least. He stated publicly I believe on here that after the other dates are done it would be a Vegas run then maybe some other US shows with I believe as it was planned at the time a final show in NY possibly Beacon Theatre.

On the flip side initially there were dates in places like SA & the far east / India spoken about that would happen before a Vegas run & they have not happened so if they will or not is anyones guess.

duke knooby
20 Aug 2013, 22:26
Really like the idea of the run on Broadway and the West end .

The west end???

that sounds like a great idea!!

LucyK!
20 Aug 2013, 22:27
Looking at the positives man, did you chose the blondes as a homage to the blind before I stop tour?

FFS...Wario, my darling....he ain't doing Masculine! Let it go!!! :lol

We are thinking of doing a show with just Justin , Randy and one girl !!

...by any chance can this be me?! :shock: ;)

Thank you for your kind words, Mr Loaf x

Fire Ball
20 Aug 2013, 22:29
Would never expect everyone to like everything I do, I don't . Don't insult my integrity.. What went down was as much as a shock to me as it was to everyone.
MeatWell there are several from me on this board. You shouldn't have a hard time finding them ;)

Besides that, you're taking me on the road. Basically I'm your passenger. That doesn't mean I have to agree with everything. I'm a passenger, not a follower... :cool:

AndrewG
20 Aug 2013, 22:31
I'm a passenger, not a follower... :cool:

You didn't call shotgun so get in the backseat. :-P

Guy
20 Aug 2013, 22:32
What went down was as much as a shock to me as it was to everyone.
Meat
There you go.
Thank-you.

JennaG
20 Aug 2013, 22:33
There are so many things being tossed around I can't keep up , finishing the album is a must. Really like the idea of the run on Broadway and the West end . When we were in Austin putting the Vegas show together it was running almost 3 and a half hours. Vegas don't like that !! So then we started talking about a speaking tour. They are looking into it. That's not like a singing tour trust me !!
Meat



That sounds interesting.

I'm not sure how I can imagine that at the moment but if you're in the West End then I'll be there. :)

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

AndrewG
20 Aug 2013, 22:35
What are the odds Meat will perform on the West End with his Speaking / Acoustic tour before the Bat Musical sees the light of day there?

CarylB
20 Aug 2013, 22:37
Why am I upset , I have been insulted my integrity has been attacked .. As if this really happened with one e-mail . Yes, I find that a very stupid assumption.

Yes it is. Some of us have repeatedly said this would not be the case. But many have clearly been posting, using words like "disgusting" etc, on an asumption that it WAS one email out of the blue .. despite a recent post here saying "The assumption that people think its about ONE mail is also a false one". It's not a false assumption .. some have clearly gone with this.

I know that nothing should have to be posted here before the shows. For various reasons . Also most the the 37.000 people that were at the 2 shows don't come here .

Of course. And those people got a tremendous couple of shows. We who were there heard the applause, have seen the many, many posts on your FB page. Most had no expectations save they would see you, and a fantastic show .. which is precisely what they got.

Do any of you understand the world we live in. ....As far as people defending me in all matters thank you.
Meat

Some of us do I think, and we are the ones you are thanking. You are more than welcome Meat. I trust your integrity implicitly, and respect your right to make decisions without consulting me or informing me of what went into them .. making them is usually hard enough without having to justify yourself to those who imo have no entitlement to be apprised of private business discussions.

You consistently deliver more than you could ever "owe" us. I am simply very sorry that you are being subjected to such a barrage of angry judgements from some people. But imo it's a minority amongst your huge fanbase. Thousands of the latter were at Newmarket and Newbury. They respect you, they applaud you, they had a wonderful evening.

suzieq
20 Aug 2013, 22:38
. Really like the idea of the run on Broadway and the West end .

The west end???

that sounds like a great idea!!

That sounds interesting.

I'm not sure how I can imagine that at the moment but if you're in the West End then I'll be there. :)

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

I'm so confused. From parts where I'm from, the West End meant a part of Manhattan.

Monstro
20 Aug 2013, 22:40
I'm so confused. From parts where I'm from, the West End meant a part of Manhattan.

Our West End (in London) would be your Broadway

CarylB
20 Aug 2013, 22:40
Would never expect everyone to like everything I do, I don't . Don't insult my integrity.. What went down was as much as a shock to me as it was to everyone.
Meat

You have been circumspect and professional in not providing details of private discussions. That IS integrity. I have never doubted that you have found this a difficult process, and it's sad that some have given no thought to your feelings in this.

C x

wizardofodd
20 Aug 2013, 22:41
West end sounds like a fantastic idea, a storytellers like show would fit perfect. Many performers have done that, one theatre over a few weeks. On the acoustic side of things i think that sounds great too, would be interested to hear an acoustic album exploring Meats lower register, I'm a massive fan of Johnny Cash's American albums later in his career, would love to hear something with that tone with Meat- as the man has said plenty of ideas flying around, great, exciting for him.

Realise this is slightly off topic but i have said my thoughts regarding Patti, I hope meat and her work together again in some capacity- there are other great vocalists out there who could quite easily have that same chemistry and relationship with Meat- we shall see. Good luck and keep calm Fireball.

Adje
20 Aug 2013, 22:41
Would never expect everyone to like everything I do, I don't . Don't insult my integrity..

I didn't. At least not more as you did mine


What went down was as much as a shock to me as it was to everyone.
Meat
That I'm more than willing to believe. But in all honesty it is besides the point. This entire topic is not, really NOT about one e-mail.

In a way you're running a 'public' buisiness. You expect certain values from your public and I think it's only fair they can expect the same from you (or your buisiness if you like). If handeled differently -in a public message on i/e facebook- you would have given respect to fans who were differently stunned about this situation.

There had not been the need to go in depth. Meat you have a publicity team, managers, crew, co-workers.

Are you telling me that nobody saw a reaction like this coming? Did nobody even consider taking your fans serious enough to give them a 2 line message?

"I'm sorry to say that Patti will not be performing with the neverland Express. Although it's a sad anouncement I like to thank Patti for everything she has done for me and the fans in the last 20 years. And we wish her well in her future."

Something simpel and perhaps even better would have solved so much from what you're facing here. It's not just an anouncement that gives -certain- fans a better idea of what to expect. But those fans feel more involved and respected. Don't forget, Patti might just have been one of the most popular member on your band.

The fact that nobody bothered to think of something simpel as that, while facebook was floated with messages about Vegas and a shirtless Randy, there surely must have been time to work on something like that.

If nobody figured the impact of Patti's sudden dissapearance than, sir, you need a new marketing team.

Tina.K.
20 Aug 2013, 22:42
What went down was as much as a shock to me as it was to everyone.
Meat

I believe that in a heartbeat! The whole thing has no winners, just losers.
A sad thing.

And as I said earlier, you cannot judge when you don't know what happened or heard both sides of the story. And because it is not of our business, you simply cannot judge. So I won't.

stretch37
20 Aug 2013, 22:49
You have been circumspect and professional in not providing details of private discussions. That IS integrity. I have never doubted that you have found this a difficult process, and it's sad that some have given no thought to your feelings in this.

C x

"some who have given no thought" being anyone who a) slightly questions Meat or Patti, or b) questions the situation as a whole, displaying utter shock and attempting understand it through discussion - This all according to your recent posts on the subject Caryl. Having read others' posts myself, I have to say that most everyone was very thoughtful, and were overall careful to write respectfully...But Apparently they lack thoughts? :-P That's as much as a put down to others on here as i've ever seen.....:(

CarylB
20 Aug 2013, 23:13
"some who have given no thought" being anyone who a) slightly questions Meat or Patti, or b) questions the situation as a whole, displaying utter shock and attempting understand it through discussion - This all according to your recent posts on the subject Caryl. Having read others' posts myself, I have to say that most everyone was very thoughtful, and were overall careful to write respectfully...But Apparently they lack thoughts? :-P That's as much as a put down to others on here as i've ever seen.....:(

Just to make it perfectly clear .. as far as I can see from some of the comments that have been posted on this thread, some would appear to me to have given no thought to Meat's feelings.

I am not going to pick through this thread to identify them, as to select a few would be unfair in my view, and to track and repost all would be appallingly negative. Some have been removed. I said "some" and I consider that to be the case. There were some posts that were most definitely in my view (and apparently in Meat's) that were certainly not respectful.

That you disagree is your right of course. If you think what I said is the biggest put down you've ever seen on here .. I am somewhere on a scale between surprised and amazed.

nikox1
20 Aug 2013, 23:21
10 years later............. And still the email saga rages on and all hope of saving humanity dissapears

ninja
20 Aug 2013, 23:25
[QUOTE=CarylB;596916]Just to make it perfectly clear .. as far as I can see from some of the comments that have been posted on this thread, some would appear to me to have given no thought to Meat's feelings.

that's so sad but unfortunately true :-(

Wario
20 Aug 2013, 23:34
FFS...Wario, my darling....he ain't doing Masculine! Let it go!!! :lol


Where did I mention Masculine? yeesh lisa you're seeing masculine everywhere.... Stop your obsession :P

What went down was as much as a shock to me as it was to everyone.
Meat
Case closed. thats all really anyone needs to hear.

stretch37
20 Aug 2013, 23:38
Just to make it perfectly clear .. as far as I can see from some of the comments that have been posted on this thread, some would appear to me to have given no thought to Meat's feelings.

I am not going to pick through this thread to identify them, as to select a few would be unfair in my view, and to track and repost all would be appallingly negative. Some have been removed. I said "some" and I consider that to be the case. There were some posts that were most definitely in my view (and apparently in Meat's) that were certainly not respectful.

That you disagree is your right of course. If you think what I said is the biggest put down you've ever seen on here .. I am somewhere on a scale between surprised and amazed.

lol. Sorry, its just that the tone you have taken on this thread from the start has indicated that anyone who even suggests they are upset at Meat because Patti said she was fired by email should not even be speaking :P So for you to say, (I'm paraphrasing) "some people are not taking Meat's feelings into account", I feel that you are over-generalizing that the people who took offense to Patti being potentially fired by email were not thinking of Meat's feelings. I'd like to suggest that you don't know what they were thinking of at the time, and that the natural reactions of surprise, anger, criticism, etc were from good people who respect Meat *and* his feelings, but were in a state of shock and disbelief and decided to share their feelings. If these are not the people your referring to, then there is no issue. Perhaps there was 1 or 2 comments that were extremely rude that you are talking about, and I just didn't see them? If that was the case, then honestly, I completely apologize for reacting, as I do not agree with someone coming on here and showing a blatant disregard for Meat's feelings. I love the man, and I would find that quite troubling indeed :(

CarylB
21 Aug 2013, 00:40
Stretch, I repeatedly said I understood people were feeling shocked and hurt etc .. so I think I did understand something of what THEY were feeling. I simply said that I doubted the email had been out of the blue, that there would have been events leading up to it, (which Meat has now confirmed) and that we did not have information on which to base a judgement .. mainly the one I saw expressed a number of times on the lines of "By an email? Disgusting!!" There were quite a few, including some today which we've seen Meat was deeply offended by. And I did say "some" .. if I were generalising I'd have said "people didn't ..." But it was clear Meat did feel he and his integrity were being demeaned by some. I know you love Meat, and wouldn't want to see his feelings blatantly disregarded. But in some cases I really think they were .. and if you missed that I'm glad .. because it troubled me, and not only me. Hope that clears it and we're good :-)

stretch37
21 Aug 2013, 00:50
Stretch, I repeatedly said I understood people were feeling shocked and hurt etc .. so I think I did understand something of what THEY were feeling. I simply said that I doubted the email had been out of the blue, that there would have been events leading up to it, (which Meat has now confirmed) and that we did not have information on which to base a judgement .. mainly the one I saw expressed a number of times on the lines of "By an email? Disgusting!!" There were quite a few, including some today which we've seen Meat was deeply offended by. And I did say "some" .. if I were generalising I'd have said "people didn't ..." But it was clear Meat did feel he and his integrity were being demeaned by some. I know you love Meat, and wouldn't want to see his feelings blatantly disregarded. But in some cases I really think they were .. and if you missed that I'm glad .. because it troubled me, and not only me. Hope that clears it and we're good :-)

Ah, yup all good :-) I must have missed something, although I think I actually did see that one about it being disgusting, but had been thinking it was on Facebook, no here, so my bad. Yes, that is troubling...And regardless of it being there or here, I found it very hard not to react and ask them if they'd even stopped to think about what Mouse mentioned the other day. That there are 3 sides to every story. For the ones who said this, it appears that they didn't even spend much time thinking about it at all, and almost instantaneously decided "Meat's the bad guy". In the case of that situation, I am 100,000% with you, and if that's all you meant, then I believe we are both equally wishing that those types of things would be left unsaid....And that the people who said those things perhaps spent a little more time with their thinking caps on :twisted: