View Full Version : I Regret Every Dime I Ever Spent On Rundgren
http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/dc9/2012/03/todd_rundgren_-_house_of_blues.php
If Todd Rundgren indeed said what the reporter claims he said, Todd Rundgren really is the douche I have always thought he was.
Early on, Rundgren appeared weary. He apologized for his voice, saying, "Just pretend you're at a Meatloaf show."
Really Todd...you are sounding desperate for a dig there.
mediameat
27 Mar 2012, 17:14
Ouch, below the belt. I agree with you on that Dave, wonder if 'unprofessional' among several other choice words is in his dictionary.
I've never liked what I've seen of Rundgren as a person; rude, sarcastic and dismissive of others. And a comment like that is typical imo, although I agree rude, unnecessary and wholly inappropriate. Those who abuse the name of fellow professionals simply show they themselves are unprofessional as well as being pretty appalling human beings in my view
Caryl
I will never forget the "Liars Tour" show I saw. Todd had a stage full of road hardened professional musicians, yet felt the need to count them in and conduct them during all of their instrumental solos.... I believe the word pompous comes to mind.
The Flying Mouse
27 Mar 2012, 18:11
:twisted: I don't think it was all that bad.
I must admit I laghed when I read the comment (even though it was a shocked laugh, but then again I like pannel shows like News For You & Buzzcocks that are always taking the piss :shrug: ).
A bit cheeky perhaps, a bit naughty, but nothing too offensive, perhaps just an affectionate dig at an old friend.
Especially since nobody knows how it was said.
If it was said with any venom, I agree that it wasn't a nice thing to say, but i'm not going to get overheated about an attack that might well not have been an attack.
Why would anyone make such a remark and not mean it? If he didn't mean it, why didn't he choose any random pop singer?
Evil Ernie
27 Mar 2012, 20:27
Is everyone on this forum a weak kneed wimp? Or a soccer (sorry, football)Mom who doesn't want anything negative ever said? I mean THINK ABOUT THE CHILDREN!
So he took a dig at Meat Loaf, so what? He KNOWS and worked with ML.
I think anybody and their dog would get tired from performing the sets Meat does. When I seen the show it was apparent he goes 100 percent from his entrance. Captivating.
Vague I know but anyone who see him perform will understand exactly what I mean. He is a hard worker. I am sure Todd always had a 'sour' perspective of Meat.
his latest album RUINED two outta three
The Flying Mouse
27 Mar 2012, 21:46
his latest album RUINED two outta three
:twisted: I can't argue with that.
I'd still like to know how he said it though.
Evil Ernie
27 Mar 2012, 21:51
his latest album RUINED two outta three
Without TR and Jim Steinman ML would be just another theatre guy who never went anywhere.
Note that Meat had opportunity to join successful group Foreigner. I'm sure Meat would've had success in whatever he pursued.
Evil Ernie
27 Mar 2012, 22:07
Note that Meat had opportunity to join successful group Foreigner. I'm sure Meat would've had success in whatever he pursued.
I stand by what I said.
Without Jim and to a lesser degree Todd, you don't have Meat Loaf. Just another actor who can sing. He would never have been given a chance. Plus he was almost 30 by the time he did actually make it.
allrevvedup
27 Mar 2012, 23:44
I stand by what I said.
Without Jim and to a lesser degree Todd, you don't have Meat Loaf. Just another actor who can sing. He would never have been given a chance. Plus he was almost 30 by the time he did actually make it.
tis your opinion and to a certain extent I would agree with the fact that Mr Rundgren and Mr Steinman helped to thrust Meat into the spotlight but in fairness he's worked long and hard to show that he can perform good songs without them.
Also, i don't really see what the issue is as the age of a person when they 'make it', it's all about what you do with the time you're in the spotlight rather than the age you are.
As Mouse says, I'd rather know the context that it was taken in as it could easily be tongue in cheek rather than insulting. I seem to remember a genuine quote from Mr Rundgren about recording Renegade Angel/Dead Ringer and that Meat's voice was basically gone.
robgomm
28 Mar 2012, 00:03
I stand by what I said.
Without Jim and to a lesser degree Todd, you don't have Meat Loaf. Just another actor who can sing. He would never have been given a chance. Plus he was almost 30 by the time he did actually make it.
Omg
Meat Loaf was a very successful stage actor in his early career, and had he not met Jim, in all probability (because no one can say for sure although you claim to) he would have carried on being a very successful stage actor and would possibly have become and even bigger film star than he is already. Without Jim you don't have Meat Loaf? Well duh he's always been called Meat Loaf even in his early acting career so chances are that, duh, you would still have Meat loaf but as a famous actor instead of musician.
Seriously, why did you even join? :facepalm:
tis your opinion and to a certain extent I would agree with the fact that Mr Rundgren and Mr Steinman helped to thrust Meat into the spotlight but in fairness he's worked long and hard to show that he can perform good songs without them.
Also, i don't really see what the issue is as the age of a person when they 'make it', it's all about what you do with the time you're in the spotlight rather than the age you are.
Exactly. Meat may have achieved initial iconic status in collaboration, but put huge effort into getting the album to take off, has kept the songs alive for over 30 years, and has proved himself over and again as a rock singer/performer.
And had he remained an actor? I think it's an insulting assumption to suggest he'd have not got anywhere. Had he devoted all his efforts to the theatre, who knows what success he might have had. This is a man recently inducted into the Texas Film HoF, and who has shown himself to be an intelligent, thoughtful and excellent actor.
Caryl
Without Jim and to a lesser degree Todd, you don't have Meat Loaf. Just another actor who can sing. He would never have been given a chance.
I do not agree.
Without TR and Jim Steinman ML would be just another theatre guy who never went anywhere.
THATS BS.
Meat still wouldve done hair, still made his mark in rocky horror, and he would've toured with Ted Nugent and would've gone in a different direction.
Meat loves jim, but his success is reliant on him. Even less is Todd. Meat and jim would've found another producer at some point.
Most of Meat's best work is without Jim: bad ATtitude, Blind Before I Stop, and A Time For Heroes to name a few things.
youngJB
28 Mar 2012, 00:38
Considering Bat Out Of Hell is hands down the biggest album Rundgren ever produced, I don't think he would really make a fool of Meat to such a degree as everyone thinks. It was just a playful dig at his old buddy. Also, Jim had far more insulting comments about Meat in the 1980s that everyone seems to have let pass.
In the end, it doesn't matter. Rundgren seems like a cool guy, but a bit of an asshole. And I'm sure Meat understands. After all, he knows the man pretty well.
Without TR and Jim Steinman ML would be just another theatre guy who never went anywhere.
why did jim and todd not just sing it themselves? WAIT!!! thats right they could never sing the way that just another singer sang it;) haha, i have all the respect in the world for Jim, todd has made a very good living off Bat 1, so whats he got to complain about?
AndrewG
28 Mar 2012, 01:11
I think it's a testament to Meat Loaf's undisputed creativity that without Kasim Sulton who supposedly was the "musical director" of the live band for years the arrangements, sound, excitement were all even better in Dec 2010 at the shows I went to. I certainly think it has always been Meat who has "directed" the show yes. That doesn't mean to say he doesn't need help but he certainly is the driving force.
Yes Steinman wrote amazing songs, but Meat had/has a vision (and I believe he probably did inspire Steinman to write certain songs yes), a persona and most importantly he has a special connection with everyone in the audience, which you cannot teach or become, you simply are.
As for Todd, well I would never go to one of his shows. The only really interesting thing he did solo to me were the great vocals in "Loving you's a dirty job". All his solo music is stuff I really don't like. I totally don't get how you go from producing Bat/the backing vocal arrangements he does/"getting" that type of music perfectly to the stuff he actually does himself, it seems very far removed (some of the music I've heard at least). But each to their own.
I'm sure it was just a joke but I can see fans would get disappointed at what he said. It's a silly thing to say I think and unnecessarily alienates fans.
I stand by what I said.
Without Jim and to a lesser degree Todd, you don't have Meat Loaf. Just another actor who can sing. He would never have been given a chance. Plus he was almost 30 by the time he did actually make it.
Meat would have had succes as an actor and most likely a broadway performer.
Quite frankly I thank the reverse of that statement may be the actual truth. Without Meat, BOH would have never been made because no one else could have sung it. Certainly not Jim (see Bad for Good) so I think Jim would have never gotten anywhere if it were not Meat. Without Meat Loaf, no one would even know who Jim Steinman is in 2012
BostonAngel
28 Mar 2012, 01:26
Meat would have had succes as an actor and most likely a broadway performer.
Quite frankly I thank the reverse of that statement may be the actual truth. Without Meat, BOH would have never been made because no one else could have sung it. Certainly not Jim (see Bad for Good) so I think Jim would have never gotten anywhere if it were not Meat. Without Meat Loaf, no one would even know who Jim Steinman is in 2012
EXACTLY. I agree with that 100%
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 01:59
Number of #1 or #2 songs by Jim Steinman: 3 (or more)
Number of hits by ML outside of JS: ???
Can you compare being a successful stage actor to having your name on one of the highest selling records of all time. Jim would have been successful any way that you look at music because he has the songs. Meat Loaf? I'm not sure that he would have done anything without Jim.
Not saying that ML isn't a great singer and that it would have been AS successful. Who knows, maybe it would have sold more with somebody else. You can't say either way.
Number of #1 or #2 songs by Jim Steinman: 3 (or more)
Number of hits by ML outside of JS: ???
Can you compare being a successful stage actor to having your name on one of the highest selling records of all time. Jim would have been successful any way that you look at music because he has the songs. Meat Loaf? I'm not sure that he would have done anything without Jim.
Not saying that ML isn't a great singer and that it would have been AS successful. Who knows, maybe it would have sold more with somebody else. You can't say either way.
Number 1 hits for Stienman since 1993?? Yeah didn't think so
Bottom line, without Bat Out of Hell, sung by Meat Loaf, Jim would have never gotten off the ground floor. Good composer or not, there would have been no songs for Air Supply or Bonnie Tyler if there had not been Meat Loaf first. Bat Out of Hell is what launched both men into the stratosphere. It was the perfect storm. Meat has done just fine post Steinman, whereas I haven't seen anything out of Jim in like 19 years. At least Meat continues to act and make some great new music
Meat Measures success by helping people. He said that in every interview. If he did that in any career he would have been happy. No one HERE is measuring success like Meat does.
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 02:34
Number 1 hits for Stienman since 1993?? Yeah didn't think so
Bottom line, without Bat Out of Hell, sung by Meat Loaf, Jim would have never gotten off the ground floor. Good composer or not, there would have been no songs for Air Supply or Bonnie Tyler if there had not been Meat Loaf first. Bat Out of Hell is what launched both men into the stratosphere. It was the perfect storm. Meat has done just fine post Steinman, whereas I haven't seen anything out of Jim in like 19 years. At least Meat continues to act and make some great new music
Celine Dion - It's All Coming Back To Me Now - BMI Song Of The Year
Boyzone - No Matter What
Tanz Der Vampire
Is it a huge list? No. But name me something that ML did comparable to those.
This is a stupid argument. It's of MY OPINION that he would not have been anywhere nearly as successful without the songs. Would he have had success? Maybe. But I liked Jim's chances without ML than the other way around. You have to keep in mind, that as brilliant as he is as a singer and an actor.... he was still a big fat guy. And guys like that generally don't get ANY chances at being a rock star. There's a reason why he's been called 'The Most Unlikely Rock Star Ever'. And good on him, but I think that even HE knows that much of his success was because of Jim and to a lesser degree Todd. And of course he helped them as well.
And I think it's great that ML is doing his thing, but I also wish that Jim wasn't in isolation.
Meat Measures success by helping people. He said that in every interview. If he did that in any career he would have been happy. No one HERE is measuring success like Meat does.
And also by the quality of the work rather than numbers. But you're absolutely right. Meat measures success in very different terms than who contributed this or that, and what numbers sold, when and where. He is bigger than that.
However, I'd Lie for You was more than a series of ????? It was a big hit.
I do however agree with the last comment insofar as that to argue Meat would not have carved a successful career in performing art away from rock and roll is pointless .. and imo from a position of ignorance as it didn't pan out that way.
However, he has a natural talent, both as an actor and a singer. Had other choices not beckoned, had he been more conforming, he might well have taken the offer to professionally train for opera, and as Andrew has said he is someone who can engage an audience with masterful skill.
But more importantly one might consider this if one doesn't have a desire to diminish him and his success. I believe he has the talent, honest self-appraisal, energy, commitment, drive and determination to have made a success of whatever path he chose. I say this because he has proved these qualities consistently throughout his career. Something to admire and respect I think. And something his fans should give him credit for and celebrate.
Caryl
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 03:22
However, I'd Lie for You was more than a series of ????? It was a big hit.
In Europe? Yes. It was less of a success in NA. Though it is one of my favorite Non-Jim ML songs.
In Europe? Yes. It was less of a success in NA. Though it is one of my favorite Non-Jim ML songs.
Well with the exception of Celion Dion nothing from your list was a success outside of Europe, so by that logic Boyzone and Vampire whatever must not have been that successful either since they were not worldwide successes
Yes, in Europe. This is the UK fan club site, and Meat never lost anything in terms of popularity here. His career never needed relaunching, he remained a household name, even lived here.
But Tanz wasn't big in the US was it? Nor did Boyzone's version of No Matter What trouble the scorer too much in NA; didn't even struggle into the top 50 in Canada .. so I thought we were basing this comparison of "success" largely in Europe
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 03:44
Well with the exception of Celion Dion nothing from your list was a success outside of Europe, so by that logic Boyzone and Vampire whatever must not have been that successful either since they were not worldwide successes
Yes, in Europe. This is the UK fan club site, and Meat never lost anything in terms of popularity here. His career never needed relaunching, he remained a household name, even lived here.
But Tanz wasn't big in the US was it? Nor did Boyzone's version of No Matter What trouble the scorer too much in NA; didn't even struggle into the top 50 in Canada .. so I thought we were basing this comparison of "success" largely in Europe
True. You got me. Poorly thought out. Tanz was never popular in the US and it never got a Canadian show. The Boyzone song was a strong worldwide success though.
And yes, I'm aware that ML never lost his popularity in the UK, but his biggest albums were known world wide. You can't compare it JUST to European sales when they've both had strong success around the world.
The main point is that (even since 1993)JS has had more success away from ML than the other way around. They are both at their best when working together.
The Boyzone song was a strong worldwide success though.
It was #1 in the UK for an ear-cringing 3-4 weeks, and as far as I'm aware was the only Boyzone hit to ever achieve popularity in the U.S, but I'm not aware it made any significant impact in the charts there; as I said it didn't make the top 50 as far as I could find in NA. It went Platinum in the UK .. (as did CHSIB and HCTB).
The main point is that (even since 1993)JS has had more success away from ML than the other way around.
Your main point. And imo unproven, one I totally disagree with, and one which won't develop more credibility simply by being repeated and continually based on the examples you give.
In my view success is measured by more than your examples. For Meat it is based on work done and delivered, and the quality of that work .. a pretty robust yardstick in anyone's book imo. Surely even the meanest critic would at least base it on things like sustained popularity, continuing to create and deliver new work which in the case of albums sells and makes an impact in the charts, continuing to perform to a level that fills theatres and arenas around the world .. and perhaps having a fansite where fans continue to get news of new releases and discuss new work delivered and out in the world.
When I saw the comparatively large number of new posts, I thought something interesting had happened (e.g. a live performance by ML), but unfortunately it's the same old silly Meat Loaf vs. Jim Steinman discussion again. :yawn: And it was triggered by... wait... a short comment by Todd Rundgren that had nothing to do with Steinman. :roll:
I think it was triggered by someone crowbarring in the comment "Without TR and Jim Steinman ML would be just another theatre guy who never went anywhere.", along with some words which have been removed. Until then it was comment on a remark made by Rundgren
robgomm
28 Mar 2012, 12:54
I think it was triggered by someone crowbarring in the comment "Without TR and Jim Steinman ML would be just another theatre guy who never went anywhere.", along with some words which have been removed. Until then it was comment on a remark made by Rundgren
It was indeed.
A Slice Of English
28 Mar 2012, 13:02
Don't feed the trolls people.
daveake
28 Mar 2012, 13:06
And back to Todd's comment, he does have a point unfortunately. In my relatively small (compared to some) sample of Meat concerts, he has rather often seemed to have left his voice behind at the previous show. My opinion, for what it's worth, is the same as something Jim said in interview ages ago - Meat's voice is one that needs rest between shows. I understand the pressures of needing to cram those shows together, but the end result is that when you go to a show you don't know if his voice will fully there or not.
Dave
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 15:09
Don't feed the trolls people.
Trolling generally means posting stuff that you don't actually believe or posting something outlandish.
Every time I come here reminds me of 'The Buddy Bears'.
z3LSZetkNSE
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 15:11
And back to Todd's comment, he does have a point unfortunately. In my relatively small (compared to some) sample of Meat concerts, he has rather often seemed to have left his voice behind at the previous show. My opinion, for what it's worth, is the same as something Jim said in interview ages ago - Meat's voice is one that needs rest between shows. I understand the pressures of needing to cram those shows together, but the end result is that when you go to a show you don't know if his voice will fully there or not.
Dave
But, but... He has such passion in his voice. He interacts with the crowd so great.
samurai7
28 Mar 2012, 15:12
somebody mentioned that Todd made his living off the back of Bat... The story I heard differs. He wasn't paid much, and funded a lot of it himself, then when it looked to be a flop he sold his producers rights. So.. make of that what you will. As for the comment. So what? you hear people say Meat can't sing, or is over the hill etc every day of the week. It's what YOU believe that matters. :roll:
Is everyone on this forum a weak kneed wimp? Or a soccer (sorry, football)Mom who doesn't want anything negative ever said? I mean THINK ABOUT THE CHILDREN!
So he took a dig at Meat Loaf, so what? He KNOWS and worked with ML.
I am not a weak kneed wimp at all. However, I am professional and an entertainer myself. I have worked with people on stage and behind the scenes that I do not get along with. I have seen Meat Loaf on top of his form and have even seen a show that could be described as a "subway going down to the pits." Never, ever have I seen Meat Loaf (even when he was having trouble with a show) ever give less than 100%. Further, even on his worst vocal day - Meat Loaf can sing the hot patootie off any vocal Rundgren could utter. I personally think Rundgren is a jerk, and until proven otherwise (and this very unprofessional statement does not help his case), I will continue to think so.
When I saw the comparatively large number of new posts, I thought something interesting had happened (e.g. a live performance by ML), but unfortunately it's the same old silly Meat Loaf vs. Jim Steinman discussion again. :yawn: And it was triggered by... wait... a short comment by Todd Rundgren that had nothing to do with Steinman. :roll:
Amen!
AndrewG
28 Mar 2012, 17:06
Trolling generally means posting stuff that you don't actually believe or posting something outlandish.
Every time I come here reminds me of 'The Buddy Bears'.
z3LSZetkNSE
Trolling as defined on Wiki
In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.
But, but... He has such passion in his voice. He interacts with the crowd so great.
What you are doing now seems to be trolling imo. Ie you've had your say but still feel it necessary to make sarcastic reverse comments which you clearly don't believe on the matter only to provoke emotional response. :roll:
Evil Ernie
28 Mar 2012, 17:26
Trolling as defined on Wiki
What you are doing now seems to be trolling imo. Ie you've had your say but still feel it necessary to make sarcastic reverse comments which you clearly don't believe on the matter only to provoke emotional response. :roll:
Gimme a break. Sarcasm is clear as day.
A what would you rather have? A conversation or a Buddy Bears scenario.
Disagreeing makes things interesting.
The Flying Mouse
28 Mar 2012, 17:29
:twisted: Enough.
This thread has gone from a comment made by TR to a ML Vs JS pissing contest to a I don't know what :wtf:
THis thread has nothing left to say :lock:
Two more things.
Anyone who wishes to make inflamatory/unduly critical posts about Jim should read Meat's post on the subject.
Anyone who wishes to make inflamatory/unduly critical posts about Meat should read the forum rules.
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