BOOH SACD...

[Kev]

How fantastic is this!!! I've never heard it before!!! Its fantastic!

Puddin, you're my new hero!

Also, I got the SACD version of CHSIB and it didn't focus on the vocals like this one is...

Anyone else got either?

[evil nickname]

If it is what I think it is, it's just the audio from the center speaker. On the actual CD, all the other instruments will be available.

[Kev]

Is it? I dunno? I'm just enjoying the vocals being the main part.

Is SACD one section from each speaker? ie vocals one, guitar another, drums another?

[AndrewG]

How come Patti's vocals have ended up on Paradise? Or am I wrong?
Certainly sounds like Patti.
Listen to 1.11 and 6.30, that's Patti not Ellen Foley!

Worse is around the 5 minute mark someone seems to have taken the tremendous amount of effort of intermixing Patti's vocals with Elen's. That's crazy! Is this the official mix? Why did they (have) to do this?

Also where did those vocal only parts from Patti come from? I can't see it being from a live show as usually they play Paradise in a lower key (like Bat and Anything for Love). I'd be interested in more vocal only parts as it would be fun to do redo the full Bat album at some point (ie new backing track with original vocals).

I've just listened to this again by layering the original track with the SACD one. That really has to be Patti, but for some reason they have taken very much care in trying to get Patti sing EXACTLY what Ellen is, you can hear differences mostly in the texture of their voices of course however around about 6.30 when they sing "I gotta know right NOW", you can hear Ellen's voice is naturally more raw at that part whereas Patti is straining more and only getting the raw bit onto the word "Now". This is really bizarre. Was there some kinda problem with the quality of Ellen's track and that's why they secretly redid parts with Patti for the SACD release ???? :sherlock:

[evil nickname]

Is it? I dunno? I'm just enjoying the vocals being the main part.

Is SACD one section from each speaker? ie vocals one, guitar another, drums another?

On this SACD there is, as you know, a 5.1 surround mix. From what I'm told (I have no surround system as I believe music sounds best in stereo), in this case, the vocals and some instrumentation is mixed mainly to the center speaker, which would mean that the other instrumentation is played over the other 4 channels and the subwoofer.
As far as I know, the other instruments aren't mixed to an individual speaker, as that would sound quite, ehm, bad.

Also, you try to isolate your center speaker (like, unplug the other ones) while playing the CHSIB-SACD, to see if it has a similar mix.

[evil nickname]

How come Patti's vocals have ended up on Paradise? Or am I wrong?

Holy sweet mother of all that's bright and shiny, you're right.

Was there some kinda problem with the quality of Ellen's track and that's why they secretly redid parts with Patti for the SACD release ???? :sherlock:

That's the only reason I can imagine: that they were somehow unable to use Ellen's vocals for those parts. Also, you'd notice that most of the female vocals must be on some other channel, as they're nowhere to be heard.

Weird.

[Kev]

that sounds top, i'll try that when home!

It really is patti too! well spotted!

[RadioMaster]

indeed it is awesome....makes you notice even more how great his voice was...

[meatloaf-unofficial]

cool, I'll download it now.... I have never heard a SACD before :-)
What others are available in that formatt?

[RadioMaster]

you dont hear the SACD you just get the centre track, which is (most of the time) vocals only

[meatloaf-unofficial]

I know and its cool.... You hear reall how much meat put in deffinatly on All Revved up at the end segmant....

[WhenItComes2LovingU]

@ AndrewG: It might be that on first listen, on a rougher vocal only track I attempted to make, Ellen's vocals aren't the best in the world. With the full mix, everyone sounds great, but on vocals only, Ellen is mostly scream and flat a good deal of the time. By comparison, the Patti vocal track is on key and raw-sounding.

[RadioMaster]

holy sh!t...that IS Patti! :shock:

its most obvious on the first "aint no doubt about it..." line

Anyone actually owning the SACD? I'd be interested if something is mentioned in the liner notes and if there's actually more re-done vocals on this.

listening to the whole song its really obvious she re-did the vocals...whats interesting is that its mostly only single words or phrases toward the end of a line, before it cuts back to the original vocal track.

[meatloaf-unofficial]

the first bit where the female vocals comes in "Ain't no doubt about it..." sounds really like Patti but as you listen to the "stop right there" it sounds as if it ins't patti at all.

Have they maybe mixed hers with Karle or does she sound like Patti?

I too would be interested to see what it says in the credit notes, so if anyone has that, please can they look it up?

[RadioMaster]

the first bit where the female vocals comes in "Ain't no doubt about it..." sounds really like Patti but as you listen to the "stop right there" it sounds as if it ins't patti at all.

Have they maybe mixed hers with Karle or does she sound like Patti?

I too would be interested to see what it says in the credit notes, so if anyone has that, please can they look it up?

holy sh!t...that IS Patti! :shock:

its most obvious on the first "aint no doubt about it..." line

Anyone actually owning the SACD? I'd be interested if something is mentioned in the liner notes and if there's actually more re-done vocals on this.

listening to the whole song its really obvious she re-did the vocals...whats interesting is that its mostly only single words or phrases toward the end of a line, before it cuts back to the original vocal track.

[DazLoaf01]

Is Patti on the stereo mix from the same SACD? I believe its 5.1 surround on one side, and stereo on the other.

[duke knooby]

i thought it was a hybrid

[WhenItComes2LovingU]

holy sh!t...that IS Patti! :shock:

its most obvious on the first "aint no doubt about it..." line

Anyone actually owning the SACD? I'd be interested if something is mentioned in the liner notes and if there's actually more re-done vocals on this.

listening to the whole song its really obvious she re-did the vocals...whats interesting is that its mostly only single words or phrases toward the end of a line, before it cuts back to the original vocal track.

Not quite on the last bit, there are portions that are still Ellen, though it is clear where it's her and where it's Patti. I wonder if this is the only mix that used this vocal track, as BOOH has been re-released several times since the SACD edition.

[RadioMaster]

Not quite on the last bit, there are portions that are still Ellen, though it is clear where it's her and where it's Patti.

yep, thats what I meant
I wonder if this is the only mix that used this vocal track, as BOOH has been re-released several times since the SACD edition.

i rather doubt it was used on other mixes, as (apparenatly) they just needed patti's vocals to cover up ellens screw ups on the vocal-only track
no need to use her for stereo mixes with all the instruments, etc coming through the same channels.

[evil nickname]

ellens scew ups

:??:

[RadioMaster]

sorry typo, scRew ups

[evil nickname]

Duh. And still, what screw ups?

Admittedly, I can't stand Paradise, but I never noticed any screw ups on Ellen's behalf. That it was for whatever reason necessary to fix some tiny parts for the surround mix does not meat that Ellen screwed up.

[RadioMaster]

i wasnt noticing any screw ups either, was just referring to earlier posts in this thread stating that the reason for the re-done voclas might be scew ups not noticable with the full instrumentation.
ok, maybe screw ups is a bit too harsh for a flat note, but you get what I mean.

[DazLoaf01]

More likely that certain parts of the original multi-tracks couldn't be located, and that Patti's voice was used as a substitute. A similar thing happened with the DVD-A release of Queen's "The Game" album, where certain backing vocals of the song "Coming Soon" couldn't be found, so they used alternate takes instead.

[Pudding]

Puddin, you're my new hero!

Who was your old hero..LOL

Thanks shouldn't be directed at me, as I'm just the bitch-in-the-middle :))

Pud :twisted:

[Ma.Ra]

the first bit where the female vocals comes in "Ain't no doubt about it..." sounds really like Patti but as you listen to the "stop right there" it sounds as if it ins't patti at all.

Have they maybe mixed hers with Karle or does she sound like Patti?

I too would be interested to see what it says in the credit notes, so if anyone has that, please can they look it up?

So they have changed the "Ain't no doubt about it..." part of Ellen, which was already on the CDs scratchty?
First I thought it would be my CD player, but the mastertapes seemed to be damaged, right?

[Wario]

I don't get what this SACD is... :(

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: SACD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Audio_CD)

[Wario]

:twisted: SACD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Audio_CD)

OH i thought it was a South American Compact Disk or something lol

[RadioMaster]

So they have changed the "Ain't no doubt about it..." part of Ellen, which was already on the CDs scratchty?
First I thought it would be my CD player, but the mastertapes seemed to be damaged, right?


either that or Ellen's voice lacked on several points....those are the two (most obvious) reasons I could imagine...

[dukesofhazard]

The SACD notes say that the original masters of Heaven Can Wait and Paradise were destroyed. It also says that parts of Paradise were overdubbed with contributions by "some of the the original artists". So if Ellen Foley re-did some vocals when the SACD was done, she possibly sounds different to when it was done originally - just like Meat.

When I listened to it in 5.1 I did notice that it sounded a bit different, but had read the notes first so didn't jump to the conclusion that Patti re-did the vocals. Haven't listened to it for a while so don't know for sure but I doubt Patti did the vocals, but if she did she's not credited anywhere on the SACD

[AndrewG]

I think it is Patti on Paradise. The bit where she sings: "I gotta know right now, do you love, will you love me forever, do you need me, will you never leave" etc. during the boy & girl duo singing part is 100% Patti. It would look stupid if they had put this in the liner notes I think.

Bit surprised to hear that the Master tapes were damaged though. They were used quite a bit on the Classic albums DVD, maybe somebody accidentally pressed record rather than play when listening to them at that point. :))

[RadioMaster]

very interesting...thanks for the info